22 Jul Results of Online Dating City Survey
A few weeks back I created a survey here at this blog asking about which dating sites worked the best for certain cities. Today I’ll share the results.
I asked for the specific names of dating sites or apps you guys used to actually meet at least three women in real life, plus the city in which you did this. Hundreds of you responded (thank you) and responses still trickle in, but here are the bulk of the results.
Most Effective Sites/Apps
-By Caleb Jones
First, I’ll cover the dating sites/apps that are most effective for most guys, irrelevant of location. Here’s the final breakdown of the top five most effective ones as reported by the respondents, in order, with my comments:
First Place – Tinder – 27%
27% of all men reported Tinder as one of the apps they’ve successfully used to meet real women in real life. 27% is, by far, the winner. On top of that, the vast majority of the respondents who selected Tinder as one of the successful apps they were using chose Tinder first, before any other site or app.
Interesting! For all the bitching and complaining men throw around about Tinder these days, for all the complaints about attention whores, flakes, and so on, Tinder is very clearly the number one dating app that men are using to successfully date online.
I’ll be honest; I was surprised. I wasn’t surprised that it was one of the biggest sites/apps, but I was surprised that it was not only number one, but number one by such a large margin. I mean, damn! The second-place app is only 15% of respondents and Tinder is almost double that.
I will re-iterate what I’ve said about Tinder before. Tinder is great for men dating within their own age range, meaning around plus or minus ten years within their own age. It clearly still works. However, Tinder is not good for much older men dating much younger women. I have had pretty much zero success with it under these conditions and many of you older guys have reported the same.
So, if you’re dating women in your age range, clearly you need to be using Tinder. If you’re an older bastard like me going after much younger women, you’re going to have to use other options. Which brings us to…
Second Place – Bumble – 15%
Second place, though a distant second, is Bumble. Now this wasn’t surprising to me at all. Bumble is pretty fantastic, and I consider it the overall “least-bad” dating site/app right now in terms of the widest level of both availability and effectiveness for most men. It’s not perfect, but it works, and it tends to not have the age problem Tinder has.
How crazy is it that perhaps the most effective dating site/app right now is the one we all poo-pooed several years ago (myself included) when we found that that there was this crazy new app that “put women in charge.” I would have never expected it to do this well, but here we are.
For now, Bumble is clearly a good option. Use it.
Third Place – OkCupid – 13%
Another surprise. About two years ago OkCupid pretty much murdered its entire search function and algorithms, making what was once the best dating site/app in the universe something that barely worked in many cities.
Yet, the data is clear; it’s the third most effective dating/site app right now despite its numerous problems. Very interesting.
Fourth Place – Plenty of Fish – 8%
POF is still hanging in there, amazingly. I personally stopped using POF several years ago, but I knew it still worked. Looks like a decent number of you are still getting dates via POF which is pretty good.
Tied for Fifth Place – Hinge, Coffee Meets Bagel and Match.com, all at 6%
Hinge being at fifth place is not a surprise at all for me. I always figured Hinge would be the next up-and-coming dating site/app. I’m actually surprised it’s not doing better than fifth place, but perhaps it will grow over time.
I’m impressed with Coffee Meets Bagel being at 6% also. CMB is the love child of Tinder and Match.com, a swipe app for slightly older folks (over 33) looking for more serious relationships. My guess is that CMB will soon replace Match.com completely. I’m frankly shocked that Match.com is showing this well, but it’s still the go-to place for over-33 divorced women looking for husband number two.
Here’s a few more rankings, if you were curious:
Badoo came in at sixth place at 4%, eHarmony, Happn, and Zoosk all tied for seventh place at 2% each. These sites came in at 1% or less: MeetMe, Skout, Tagged, Meetic, Hitch, JDate, How About We, and Speeddate.com. Everything else on my original list got literally zero responses.
Custom Write-In Sites/Apps
In the survey I provided a space where guys could write in any site/app they used to successfully meet at least three women in real life that I hadn’t listed. The results were interesting.
Number one on this list is FetLife. This is the dating site for you kinky BDSM bastards. Awesome. I have never used this site myself but a lot of you have emailed me about this over the years. An advantage of this site is that women on FetLife likely have far less ASD than normal women, making getting to sex very fast on Fetlife something much easier than on normal dating/sites apps. I highly recommend you guys check this out unless you like your sex extremely vanilla.
The strong second place winner on this list was WeChat. WeChat? Really? Huh.
For those of you who don’t know, WeChat is the Chinese version of WhatsApp. It’s essentially a messaging app. Apparently a decent number of you guys are meeting Chinese girls (and other Asian women) via an app that I thought was mostly just a messaging app but can also double as a social media platform and dating app. Very cool, guys!
Other strongly showing regional apps are DateInAsia.com for Asians, Adopteunmec for French speakers, Filipino Cupid for Filipinos, ThaiFriendly.com for Thais.
Another big app a lot of you reported success with is Jswipe, which I didn’t even know about, but I’m not surprised it works, since it’s for dating Jewish women who are perhaps the most sex-positive of any race/religion I’ve ever come across.
A few of you older guys also reported that TheInnerCircle.co works very well, which is a dating site for higher-income folks. I have a feeling that some guys are using this to run pseudo-sugar daddy game, but whatever you guys are doing, it’s working.
Lastly, a huge number of you reported getting dates using normal social media, mostly Instagram and Facebook. I’ve also heard a lot of women meetting guys under a dating context using social media sites in the last year or so. As I’ve said before, I’ve predicted that social media game will start getting much more popular, and the data seems to reflect this. I’ll keep a closer eye on this as time goes on. I talk about social media game in the Ultimate Online Dating Manual. It works (I’ve done it many times), but it takes a little more time and rapport-building than normal online dating.
Individual Cities
In terms of what sites work best in individual cities, that’s a little too complicated to go over here, so instead I’ve set up a table at the Alpha Male 2.0 Forums where you can review the results from reports from about 300 different guys all over the world. The exact thread is here. I don’t list every single app in every single city, just the top three per city. I may add more data later.
I will re-do this survey every few months to update the information.
Apparently, and you never know for sure about this stuff, Facebook is introducing a dating app into its platform later this year. Maybe they will, maybe they won’t. It could be a game-changer, or it could fizzle into nothing, but I’ll be keeping a close watch on it and report what I find.
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AlphaOmega
Posted at 05:42 am, 22nd July 2019Tinder can work great outside of age range if you put a different age on it. I have also done that successfully. About half of the women or more don’t mind at all provided I told them at the right moment, which sometimes can be after having had sex a few times.
I have tried Bumble and some other stuff and I never met anyone from those, whereas from Tinder I had scores of dates and it does work very consistently even in a relatively small town like this one but it does take some work and some special tricks.
Lazy Blitz, a Storm of Openers!
Posted at 06:25 am, 22nd July 2019I can confirm that I have had tremendous success sending thousands of openers automatically on OkCupid.com, Badoo/Bumble (they use the same database of dating profiles), DateInAsia.com, Thaifriendly.com and Pinalove.com
I use Tinder more manually, but I guess perhaps certain paid account are worth giving a shot. Tinder usually has better GPS localisation of profiles. But sorely lacks height, weight and other profile info.
Paul
Posted at 06:29 am, 22nd July 2019@AlphaOmega: how were able to get any matches at all in the first place with Tinder lol…because I’ve re-downloaded and tried about 4 different times now within the past year and every friggin time it’s the same result: not even 1 damn match (well a couple times there were “matches” but they ended up being bots so I don’t count those)….and I even spent some money on getting professional pictures done which are by far my best that I’ve ever had and it still hasn’t seemed to matter at all. So at this point, I’ve really wondered how any guy out there is able to get anything at all from Tinder. Now yes I know ultimately it’s a numbers game but I’ve already swiped hundreds/ thousands over the past year and actually feel like I have swiped through every profile at this point so I’m at a loss for words of why it hasn’t worked for me
Eug
Posted at 07:11 am, 22nd July 2019Interesting results … I was a little upset seeing tinder at the top here but understand why it would be. A part of me wonders if guys are lowering their standards a bit for the types of girls they like/match with compared to say 4-5 years ago. Just my gut feel but no way to prove this.
Wouldn’t it make sense though that, despite things being harder overall, that the two biggest swipe apps by far would still be bringing in the most dates overall for guys (just based on overall use/market share)?
I was a little surprised that you were surprised.
POB
Posted at 08:19 am, 22nd July 2019Tinder is king because:
it’s easy to set-up
its easy to use
it has the best gps by far
it’s the top brand everybody knows, like uber or youtube
it still work for hook-ups
All the other options have hurdles you must jump, be it a bunch of useless compatibility tests, insane photo size limitations or clunky chat features;
AlphaOmega
Posted at 08:29 am, 22nd July 2019This was literally me before I made some adjustments and since then I won’t say I get dates easily but I can get them reliably. If I really work it hard I can get dates at least one in two weeks or more. And that is in a city of less than 200 000 where the girls are very picky and very bitchy. I’ve seen it’s much easier in some other places when I traveled. Your description makes a huge difference. In fact many of my dates specifically told me they swiped yes on me because of what I had in my description and that they do read them. Also it’s not enough to just get pro pictures – they need to be right kind of pictures and if they are they don’t need to be professional. Basically you need to think of the picture as a work of art – just adding instagram filter to your picture can already cause you to get 4x the matches. Also you shouldn’t have a lot of pictures, I got maybe 60+ dates having exactly 2. As for the rest it’s just tricks and I am working on an ebook / blog that will teach that for money, but it’s not ready yet and when / if it will be I am not sure how to tell you about without BD complaining, but let’s see maybe him and me can work out some affiliate thing or something.
It could also be that it’s just not actively used in your area despite you people showing up there. Have you tried using the paid membership and changing to a different location? That’s the reality check to see if something is wrong with the way it is used in your area (or not used) or if your profile is just really really bad.
Main problem with Tinder and I guess online dating in general is that even very average women get a yes on pretty much every swipe they do. So even if they are nice sometimes they just can’t manage the guys and don’t respond or even stop swiping further because it’s already too much… You need to know the right things to be able to get past this.
AlphaOmega
Posted at 08:40 am, 22nd July 2019Haha yes even with women who are very inexperienced / looking for something very serious. The fact that you can meet easily and quickly is enough regardless of what she says or thinks she wants.
Yes it is great, I have used it in the past while travelling and with the paid membership you can change location so I can arrange dates in the city I am visiting in advance, all while still using the same profile you use in your city where you live without changing anything else.
Oh yeah those tests that are obligatory are horrible and they hinder your chances to meet the right partner because many women do look at the results.
I am not sure why you think that is a bad thing, it’s part of the success of Tinder and why it works, last thing you want is to give a woman more options to filter you out before you even have a chance to open her / for her to see your pics. Also, who doesn’t lie about those things when its compulsary? Makes these things utterly pointless. It’s already bad enough that women can filter you by age.
What I see is that it became way more mainstream in recent years so it’s now very easy to find and match and get dates with normal girls on tinder. 4-5 years ago it was still a bit niche. If you wanna date ultra hotties its very hard on tinder but slightly above average or cute girls isn’t hard at all, you can get loads of those and many of those turn out be really hot / really good in bad later and just had really really bad profile pictures.
Yes that is exactly the thing, it is so mainstream you can find normal girls and often girls you actually know there, unlike other things. To get same results with other apps / sites takes way way more time and effort than tinder at least where I live.
Caleb Jones
Posted at 09:27 am, 22nd July 2019Of course. That’s always true. I don’t lie because doing so is antithetical to Alpha Male 2.0, but anyone else is welcome to.
This likely has to do with your Facebook account rather than Tinder, as well as the city in which you live. In other words, re-installing it to your phone probably won’t make any difference. That being said, I would be curious if you downloaded it to a brand new device (like a tablet using wifi), if that made a difference. (Probably not but it’s worth an experiment.)
This is also my gut feeling but as I constantly say, “feelings” about these kinds of “facts” are usually wrong. Just because the women you see on dating sites you “feel” are less attractive to you doesn’t mean that A) men are fucking uglier women or B) that the women you’re seeing are having any sex at all. Remember that, as just one example, the Millennial generation is having less sex now than any other generation before them.
True. Good point.
At some point soon I will indeed work with other online dating guys who are active in the trenches now, since in the next few years, as I enter my 50s, online dating may be something I just stop doing entirely and just focus on roster FBs and referral game. (I’m not there yet, but I may get here soon.)
Eug
Posted at 10:18 am, 22nd July 2019@BD
Makes sense. Though I didn’t mean in terms of my thinking the women on tinder overall are less attractive.
Plenty of attractive women on there…but was throwing out there that 1) the matches that you do end up getting are less compared to say 4-5 yrs ago, and 2) even if everything is tight and you do get around the same amount of matches, it’s not with the same quality cute girls as from before. Which would then lead guys to start giving likes to girls (and subsequent matches) they wouldn’t have given likes to a while ago, because of a bigger lack abundance with the same quality cute girls as before. The size of the tinder market would still ensure that guys are still going out and getting laid from it.
Basically, the lack of abundance and extra scarcity mindset incentivizes men to have to start swiping right on a category of girls they wouldn’t have before, and it’s just slowly become the new norm.
I’m basing this in part on various reference points for myself and yes, I realize I’m generalizing amongst other guys based on what I’m thinking … but I’ll be VERY glad to be wrong on this.
But also to your point about women not necessarily having as much sex and millennials having less sex –
IF guys WERE succumbing to liking/matching/going out with a lower quality of girls compared to before, then why can’t it also mean that the cute girls on tinder aren’t necessarily having sex (just not really matching with guys the same as before, happy w/ validation on IG/FB, etc.), AND that guys are having not just less sex but also less sex with less cute girls from dating apps? Why can’t all the above be true?
This is not something I have a hard opinion on FYI – but something I’ve thought about from what I’ve seen over the last 5 years or so in various countries. But I would LOVE for the above to be wrong.
JJ Roberts
Posted at 10:18 am, 22nd July 2019Funny I have used all 5 of the top five.
Number of people I have met = zero.
AlphaOmega
Posted at 10:20 am, 22nd July 2019You can open a Tinder account without Facebook with just a phone number.
And yet you used to advise to do exactly that provided we tell her at some point.
C Lo
Posted at 10:50 am, 22nd July 2019I hardcore dissed Tinder till I went on a convention trip to a neighboring city.
Holy smokes my profile blew up.
If you are having trouble it’s worth asking if it’s in your area, especially if you live in a smaller area.
AlphaOmega
Posted at 11:50 am, 22nd July 2019Its not only that, Tinder puts you at the TOP of the list if you are new in the area. You see the thing is because of the way women swipe (or not swipe) you need to be at the top of the list to have realistic results. That makes it the number one thing by far for travel dating.
So you just do day game?
Couldnt be more wrong. It is way way easier now than in the past because it has become so mainstream. I will admit it is very location dependent – in some areas tinder has very bad reputation and or people don’t take it seriously but for example here it was a niche 4-5 years ago and now its the standard way to meet someone, even very innocent inexperienced girls use it here to “find a nice guy”. I couldnt get dates with tinder 4-5 years ago and now if i put the effort in it I can get reliably dates about 1-2 dates every couple of weeks most of the time. I have seen it works very well when travelling nowadays in a lot of places also.
Look, basically the thing is the same as it has always been (or ever since I can remember…) online dating is almost exactly like in offline dating: women are outrageously picky and that forces men to be the opposite but then women are like this because men are like that and men are like that because women are like that – its a closed circle, you get the point… So men have low entry point for sex but have high entry point for something more serious or long term because they often get the women that are ok to fuck maybe once or maybe on regular basis but not really fully what they want in a girlfriend or wife. This leaves a lot of frustrated and upset women who feel used and its because a lot of men are frustrated its too hard to get the women they want. Again, a vicious circle. On top of that there is the fact that a lot of women are at least content with not dating or having sex for periods of time or are waiting for the right guy or whatever and or have terrible dating skills which often ruin things and on top of that discard potentially good partners based on something small. This creates a large imbalance in the dating and sexual market which is part of the problem. Again, a solution on individual level is to be one of those more attractive guys and also to have non monogamy. I do not know if there is a solution on mass level, I guess it will take some major societal changes such as a collapse.
I think its the exact same as it has always been, or by always I mean as far as I know, and I have been dating or trying to date for about 15-20 years. So that is the reality of it and its because of the things I have described above. I am not sure why you are hoping to be wrong though? It’s normal case of supply and demand. Large part of the “problem” is that men and women don’t realize that the stuff they are doing as a way to avoid this stuff they don’t want is exactly the cause for that situation so they make it worse: for example women making dating less easy and full of nonsense is leading to the fact that many men only use them for sex, or men giving too much attention to women without getting sex and going for unattractive girls means it becomes harder to get those things.
Kjell
Posted at 11:53 am, 22nd July 2019Every one I know personally, male or female is on tinder, ages 18-40. If I ever meet a couple, sometimes I ask how they met, a lot of them say tinder. It’s the norm. And as far as lying about my age, just to get around tinder’s age rules, of course I do! Girls lie about their weight or whatever. I’ve had girls figure it out, but only if they stick around. Rest of them had no clue or didn’t care.
AlphaOmega
Posted at 01:08 pm, 22nd July 201960-70% of women I ever kissed / had sex with were from Tinder. And I started having success with tinder only about 2-3 years ago. I am now seeing 3 women and 2 of them are from Tinder and the the third is an old connection that came back to my life after about 6-7 years but back then I knew her from some obscure dating site, but other than her I never had sex with any women from online dating site that was not Tinder.
As for the tinder age thing – remember this: if you are a premimum member you can hide your age… now why would you need that if the members can select the age range they want and otherwise you dont show up to them at all? Well of course, Tinder knows people lie about theyre age so they are trying to make money on it… Having said that I dont think hiding the age is a good idea, better to just tell her at some point what your age is.
AlphaOmega
Posted at 01:24 pm, 22nd July 2019I have to say on the other hand that part of my success with tinder and the techniques I use I attribute to what I have picked up here.
I have bought some stuff from BD but never the one on online dating but a lot of the techniques I have used to were based on his articles which did fill my calendar with dates.
I just transposed it to tinder as far as I see the only difference is you have to get matched before you can open a girl and the rest is the same and before you get matched the things he said about profile photo certainly helped.
I have no idea if he has stuff about how to write profile description in online dating in his book since I didnt get it but I figured that on my own and it was perhaps the single thing that made most difference to me.
The rest were things that were either obvious or I picked up from his articles.
Then there are a lot of secret tweaks and tricks that are specific to the app (or maybe not since I pretty much only use tinder) which make a huge difference also which BD probably doesn’t know about but looking elsewhere online nor do many other people so thats why I am considering to start my own blog about how to do tinder on easy mode.
GoodSenseCoolKid
Posted at 02:10 pm, 22nd July 2019yall remember this Tinder chick pullin off this stunt on the #1 ranked site in NY? lol… https://youtu.be/wH2wVKzm0SM
POB
Posted at 02:16 pm, 22nd July 2019Some tips for Tinder guys who are over 35 (I’m 39 soon to be 40):
– Write a short profile description. It makes a HUGE difference;
– If you’re going for women closer to your age range (30-39), post a picture with a baby or small child;
– Post a picture with a dog (I usually save it for my last picture, but it increases your odds with all ages);
– Open with something funny and out of the ordinary. YOUR TWO FIRST TEXTS ARE THE MOST IMPORTANT to grab her attention (opener + second text).
– Pitch the date after 5-6 exchanges. Yes, this is standard BD advice, but it’s almost mandatory on Tinder. She’ll forget about you if you don’t ask for a date and get her to comply to your first flow of texting. Changing to IM is also important, so she can see you as someone who’s closer to her.
X
Posted at 03:13 pm, 22nd July 2019Seriously? Your profile will look exactly like other ten thousand betas on Tinder. Every dummy there has a picture with a dog. Every single one.
Eug
Posted at 03:23 pm, 22nd July 2019@Alphaomega
come on man .. women are using tinder to “find a nice guy?” Lol. I honestly had literally the exact experience as you, and it falls in line with BD’s own process of a dating app becoming saturated and mainstream. In the early days it was SUPER easy to match with cute girls, super easy to go on dates, and more women were serious. I could literally grab a phone # with 3 dumb basic messages and schedule a date. Why? Because it was new and exciting, most women weren’t yet jaded by the app and it wasn’t yet called just a “hookup” app, they were more open to things, and probably the main reason… it wasn’t yet saturated by tons of other guys. Now it’s very different, women stop responding to messages much more often then before, etc. But who knows I might have a lot of stuff I need to fix.
Maybe it’s the area you live in… but I’ve seen the complete opposite in 3 completely different areas … everything got harder, not easier.
Eug
Posted at 03:31 pm, 22nd July 2019@alphaomega
also man you just said yourself that you only saw success on tinder 2-3 yrs ago. Meaning you don’t actually know what it was like 5 years ago when that shit was legitimately easy and not as saturated. Just saying.
AlphaOmega
Posted at 04:11 pm, 22nd July 2019Thats not what I am saying. I am saying that is what they are saying they are doing. But honestly the point is its so mainstream there are even women like that on it. THAT was my point? Get it? Its not about what they are looking for or not looking for, or whether that is really what they want or not. The point is its so mainstream even stuff like this is common.
Well my experience is the opposite. In the early days it was near impossible but now it works reliably. One of the women I am seeing now, we fucked on first date and shes the kind of girl who was looking for something serious and wasnt up for hookups. I am not saying this to brag but to show what kind of women are now common on tinder because shes def not a rare exception. Being on tinder no longer means shes looking for fun or hookup its now a standard mainstream way to get dates.
Sounds like it.
It probably means they moved to other apps, so you should try that. But I have tested tinder while travelling in other locations and I can see there are places where its useless and places where its super easy- so as I said its very location dependent
Maybe I wasn’t clear but I have been using since about 4-5 years and it I had pretty much zero or near zero success back then whereas now its very reliable since about 2-3 years ago.
So my experience is literally the opposite of you have described.
Caleb Jones
Posted at 08:11 pm, 22nd July 2019Correct, but as I talk about in the Ultimate Online Dating Manual, just make sure it’s at least 5-6 exchanges and not the classic 2-3. Women on dating sites need fast closes but women on dating apps need a little more time. (A little, not a lot.)
Caleb Jones
Posted at 08:14 pm, 22nd July 2019Correct. I still advise that (as long as it’s just a few years and you come clean very soon), and my comment above doesn’t conflict with that.
Greg
Posted at 09:29 pm, 22nd July 2019I’ve met with women from FetLife and have also had sex with ones from it, but that’s only because I put in a lot of work and have been blocked 800 times on it over 7 years of using it, so unless you’re very good looking, my advice is don’t waste your time being on it, as it’s too much work.
With getting to sex very fast on FL – yes, if you’re willing to pay for it and/or if you’re into overweight fatties, which I’m not. The hotter chicks on it – no, unless you’re hot looking yourself (you’re at least an 8 out of 10).
FL is one of the most terribly designed and set up websites you can come across, in that it has almost 75% abandoned profiles (users on the site keep complaining about this, but the site’s owner is very stubborn to innovate), plus there’s heaps of overweight fatties on it and many women on it have psychological problems, while most others on it are just complete time wasters who are just on it for personal validation seeking reasons, with no interest to meet up.
AlphaOmega
Posted at 02:31 am, 23rd July 2019Never heard of it before and yet when I read about it it says specificaly it distinguishes itself by being a social network rather than dating site. So that is specifically what they do, so makes sense its not set up to date. Thing is about non dating sites is that people there arent there interested in meeting someone – even way more so than tinder so the numbers required are way way higher.
I am curious if anyone has experience with using LinkedIn or Couchsurfing to get dates/ sex? I have heard many times about people doing both but never tries myself. If someone has experience – how do you do it?
That is my experience with online dating and even dating in general. Already when I see a woman looking to date / find relationships and says she doesn’t want hook ups I already marked her in my mind as mentally damaged. Like as if you could have a relationship without going through a hook up first. Or women who ask you what you want – like as if you could know what you want from her before getting to know her and banging her a few times.
Michael
Posted at 03:14 am, 23rd July 2019The platform I think has the most promise is Facebook. The chicks I connect with through Tinder and OkC are mostly examples of chicks where I have to be an actor playing a part to get anywhere with them.
On Facebook, I know literally hundreds of good looking chicks who go out of their way to interact with me. A few of them would definitely hook up with me if we lived closer, and I might go get some when I take my next vacation, if I don’t have anything going on closer to home. There is no easier way for me to get the attention of a hot chick, get her laughing, and say outrageously raunchy things to her. Compared to dating sites, Facebook is a gold mine of seduction. You can see her deepest insecurities, what kind of shit makes her laugh, how happy she is with her life, any relationships she’s in, and in some cases what her kinks are. It’s a longer, more methodical game. It’s Art of Seduction, not Bang. I’m just a lion lazily studying an entire herd of these chicks, waiting to swoop in when I see an opportunity.
AlphaOmega
Posted at 03:16 am, 23rd July 2019How soon is very soon though? One of the girls I am seeing now is 9 years younger and she thinks I am same age as her, I’ve been dating her for several weeks now but she just left the city for the rest of the summer. I am planning to tell her when she comes back (and we had sex a few more times) but one of my other girls thinks I should just not tell her anymore at this point.
John
Posted at 04:14 am, 23rd July 2019My opinion on a few dating sites from a seasoned pro.
Just finished my last go around with both Tinder and Bumble. For good this time.
It seems most women there are just using the apps as means to pimp their Instagram accounts.
I really think any dating app that allows Instagram linkage is a waste of time because most of these profiles of women you’re swiping right on are vacant.
A lot of women on Match are there for younger men. In some cases, much younger. I’d describe Match as a more sophisticated Cougar Life.
I found Coffee Meets Bagel to be a complete waste of time and money. The theory of only giving you so many matches per day so you can concentrate on the ones you get is a crock. I’d get like five matches a day for the time I was on there. Anyone who has ever online dated knows what the odds are in striking something up out five matches are. Geez. I figured I’d get more matches if I bought more “beans”. Nope. Biggest waste of $47 ever.
Just my 2 cents. Don’t let my negative personal experiences sway you in any way.
AlphaOmega
Posted at 04:23 am, 23rd July 2019@ John,
Like was said here before it is very location dependent. I also find it is very time of year dependent – there are so months I can get easy dates left and right and months where its nothing, but the average over the year is good.
I have seen the instagram thing on tinder and also wondered about that but I have met women who had that so I don’t see it as an issue by a long shot.
Neil
Posted at 04:47 am, 23rd July 2019I knew a guy who was travelling around the world on a budget and he used to use Couchsurfing, not only as a place to stay but as a way in to meet girls.
He used to pick places that were hosted by women and then if he fancied them, he’d game them and sleep with them or if he didn’t fancy them he’d offer to take the girl and her friends out for a drink as a pretence to say thanks for the stay at her place and then hit on any of her friends he liked. I don’t think you can really use it as a system beyond that as the shear lack of beds available for single guys that are hosted by #1 women only and #2 women only in a city you want to stay, are very small unless it’s somewhere like London, Sydney, New York etc.. that has a large female population. Throw in the fact that her friends may well be ugly/plain and I just see it as a cheap way to travel with possible benefits on the side!? Also it’s a younger guy thing as once you become an Alpha 2.0, would you really be using Couchsurfing!? I mean you could book a hotel and then spend one night trying it but it just seems to inconsistent to merit trying it regularly as a dating method.
You’d be better off combining it with daygame (which he did) or possible online game.
Greg
Posted at 05:22 am, 23rd July 2019If Tinder goes off of your Facebook pics, why doesn’t Facebook launch its own dating app to compete with Tinder, as that’d pose a serious threat to them, due to the much greater ease of matching your Facebook account and pics, with your Facebook dating app profile. If Facebook are intending to launch their own dating app, then what’s taking them so fucking long.
Unless you’re very good looking and are at least an 8 out of 10 and/or have outstanding social circle game skills, I wouldn’t use Facebook messaging to get dates, as it could be awkward if a guy got turned down.
In most cases, it’s rather hard for someone on Facebook to get and/or see a private message from someone on Facebook messenger, unless yous are friended first.
Eug
Posted at 05:53 am, 23rd July 2019@alphaomegle
out of curiosity what’s your age range and, what would you say were some of the biggest tweaks/elements that made tinder more successful for you the last few years?
Lazy Blitz, a Storm of Openers!
Posted at 05:55 am, 23rd July 2019Because in certain cities such as in Thailand or Philippines, I have tons of matches and lots of possible dates so I am a picky bastard and I want to have more option to filter out women, especially height and weight. I can do that with other sites than Tinder.
Lazy Blitz, a Storm of Openers!
Posted at 05:59 am, 23rd July 2019Where can I learn more about that ?
Lazy Blitz, a Storm of Openers!
Posted at 06:15 am, 23rd July 2019Same here, and I tried in a city where I have tons of sex and go on as many first dates as I can schedule if I want with other apps and sites. But this app is utterly useless.
Caleb Jones
Posted at 08:20 am, 23rd July 2019This book, chapter 15. Summary: having sex with your FB’s / MLTR’s friends and/or family members with her help. It’s the fastest way to get laid (outside of paying hookers) but it’s only for more advanced guys and only works with women under age 23.
hollywood
Posted at 08:26 am, 23rd July 2019I am not sure if BD meant to provide the audio and extended audio for free on this post, but I am responding to the extended audio.
Where I live, online dating isn’t really applicable because the population is too low. However, I have for a while, occasionally used FB to meet women. And I use a completely cold approach with no mutual friends. That’s how I got my most recent FB. I usually add them, then wait a few days. If no response, it’s going to be even harder, but open them with a typical opener. Often you will get this response either shortly after adding them (which usually means they are very interested) or shortly after sending your opener. Ready for it?
“Um do I know you?”
It is a basic shit test. She would know if she knows you or not. If she had no interest at all, wouldn’t she never accept the request, or would she message you about it all? I doubt it. But the way you answer this question determines if you get anywhere at all. It is that important. First, here is how most guys answer it.
“I’m not sure, you look familiar”
“I added you by mistake”
“Just trying to make new friends”
“No, I think you are hot though.”
You get the point. Being too weak to say what you really are after. The last line could potentially work for some I suppose, but still isn’t bold enough. Here’s what works for me almost every time.
“No, you don’t know me, but I came across your profile and you are single, so I was thinking about hitting you up some time.”
This results in a wow factor usually. She’s like “Wow, he’s got some balls to just say what he wants.” It’s a very alpha way to answer. And she is used to guys being vague or coy about it as they try to gauge her response. What’s the point in being vague? Time management. I tell her I added her to hit her up because she’s single. If she’s not interested she will let me know right away. Otherwise, you just said you were going to hit her up, so now you already basically have. Next thing to do is say “We should meet up for a drink on Tuesday.”
Hope this helps some of you with the Facebook game.
AlphaOmega
Posted at 08:59 am, 23rd July 2019Yes but I find you have to hit ridiculous numbers to get anywhere with facebook plus I don’t really like my dates having my facebook. Since tinder works so fine for me I don’t see a reason to use anything else for the moment, but I do experiment with other things once in a while.
You mean my search range for women? Depends on which age on my profile I use and what I am looking for specifically but I have done 18-40 max in the past, usually I just stick with under 30 though. When I am using an age of 24 then I set age range 18-23 or 18-24, and when I use higher age (but still lower than my actual age) then I set it 24/25-32. Lately I have mostly been using 18-23 since I am already dating 3 women now and they are all 23+ so I am mostly interested in under 23 now. The youngest woman I have met from tinder was 19 and the oldest was 36 (I think). Most of them were mid – late twenties, but there were quite a few in early twenties and early thirties also.
As for the fake ages I have used to date on tinder then I have used: 24, 27, 28 and 30. My age is 33 and I look like mid-late twenties. The women who thought I was 24 did not question it. I find that 24 is pretty much requied to hit the right numbers with under 23 women, though 27 can work too. For mid twenties + then having an age of 27-30 is perfectly fine. Women in early 30s mostly want to date someone of they’re own age but I am not interested in online dating that age group.
That is an information I need to put down on paper and think of how to be formulated because it’s more involved than just a few sentences and it also means it is something I will not give for free, but right now I am still working on the website.
Imch
Posted at 12:56 pm, 23rd July 2019Match.com “is” Meetic in Europe, both if you use a web browser and app-wise (no Match.com will be available in your Play Store/Apple Store).
The home page’s outstanding feature is the Gentleman’s Badge. Its purpose is to free women from having to deal with undeserving men and have them only deal with the deserving ones.
To get the Badge the men have to comply with a number of requirements, but, ultimately, it’s the women they will contact who are going to confer, or not confer, the Badge to the man.
The site suggests giving it to men who are respectful, of themselves as well as ladies, and who know that A GREAT STORY STARTS FROM LITTLE DETAILS IN THE BEGINNING (of course it’s all on the men, to put the details there and to make them right; the ladies’s duty is to judge and decide).
There is nothing about a Gentleladies’ Badge. I was thinking of sex-based discrimination in the first moment, then it dawned on me that such badge would not be purposeful, for all ladies are gentleladies — and more so as time goes.
Also, men are still signing up and using the site — this proves the policy is a correct one.
AlphaOmega
Posted at 01:18 pm, 23rd July 2019Well theres also the fact that guys wouldn’t care about that and would still contact girls regardless of this and try to get dates with them. In a way it relates to how society works: men are valued on they’re accomplishments and personality (gentleman) and women on they’re attractiveness and fertility (young age, large breasts and wide hips etc). The flipside of this is that any woman who thinks shes helping herself by focusing on being more lady like to get the right men is fooling herself. Being bitchy (wanting badges and other nonsense) is both opposite of being lady like and also not helping her get the right men. This is a great example of how stuff that makes it harder for men to date hurts women very badly. I guess what it does is it filters the user base to extreme beta males so its great for provider hunter women, though such women are often most unhappy with the men they meet even though they end up dating exactly the kind of men they say they want and that they are doing things to attract. Confusion galore.
X
Posted at 04:29 pm, 23rd July 2019I never paid for CMB but I find it works really well here in Australia. I reckon it works better for 30+ men. Also, it’s 80% Asian women on this app here. I converted more matches to dates on CMB than on any other app or site.
DonQuibollox
Posted at 09:01 pm, 23rd July 2019Totally agree with Greg about FetLife. Aside from its fat/fucked-up userbase, the owner prevents geographical search, so you can’t easily filter for kinky people who live near you and you might actually meet IRL. Better to keep it all in the online (water) closet that is FL, huh.
Caleb Jones
Posted at 08:49 am, 24th July 2019For the readers/lurkers, notice in the comments how often an online dating site/app will not work at all in one city but work great in another. It’s an important point, and a big part of the reasoning behind this article and this data.
Skills
Posted at 11:56 am, 24th July 2019No only a city but age group, individual, race, country etc…. Too many variables for me Tinder and pof (including quality) has been the worst while bumble and okkupid the best… Is the same with venues there will be a country and state in that country and club in that city that will be good for one dude vs the other….Also now tinder changed the algorithm to favor populated locations(time of the day also important)….
Lazy Blitz, a Storm of Openers!
Posted at 06:10 pm, 24th July 2019@Hollywood
Thanks for your facebook gaming detailed ideas!
Lazy Blitz, a Storm of Openers!
Posted at 06:22 pm, 24th July 2019Thanks Blackdragon. Compared to the basic version, does the ultimate version of this book provide with any significant additional content about referral game?
Caleb Jones
Posted at 08:31 pm, 24th July 2019With referral game specifically, no.
True, but I don’t think those things create a radical difference in terms of what sites/apps are effective. For example, if you have a 25 year-old white guy in Chicago who is absolutely kicking ass with OKCupid but getting nothing with Tinder, you won’t then have a 30 year-old Hispanic guy also in Chicago who is getting nothing with OKC but getting tons of women with Tinder.
joelsuf
Posted at 09:44 pm, 24th July 2019What do you consider “older men dating much younger women,” BD?
For example, I’m 37. Would it be a stretch to go after chicks in their 20s on Tinder? I still look like I could pass for 25ish. Aside from some gray facial hair that you need to study in order to really see, I don’t look 37.
Also, and this is for BD and everyone else, is it a good idea to fake your age on Tinder? I have my actual age and I match up with meh to average looking chicks my age, as well as big chicks in their 20s. If I lowered my age 10 years, would I get better results?
I don’t really care about a chick finding out or anything since all I want are FBs anyways.
Greg
Posted at 10:24 pm, 24th July 2019If you’re in your late 30s, look after yourself and regularly work out, you should absolutely lie about your age on Tinder, especially since other guys on it probably also are, but don’t say you’re like 40 or 50 and put your age as 25, as it’s not realistic.
Incognito
Posted at 10:37 pm, 24th July 2019Except, as you said yourself, Tinder tends to be crappy for older men looking for younger women.
AlphaOmega
Posted at 01:50 am, 25th July 2019This was literally discussed in detail in the comments above.
I have such a FB in my portfolio now who thinks I am her age when I am actually 9 years older. Would you say I shouldn’t bother telling her?
I guess you have two options then: use such age and write on your profile that you are obviously not 25 etc or just do sugar daddy.
What is the difference between reader and a lurker? Lurker is someone who reads but not comments?
Anyway, in this case you will need to find a way to get way higher responses.
AlphaOmega
Posted at 03:20 am, 25th July 2019What is the best way to find dates with single mothers? I have a fetish for this right now but there don’t seem to be many of them in my area.
Greg
Posted at 07:00 am, 25th July 2019Single mothers don’t go to bars or clubs, so use Tinder, Bumble, POF, OKC, Badoo, probably Match. In my experience, having met quite a lot of single mothers in Australia, most were/are a total waste of time as they’re:
– overweight and don’t regularly exercise, from not having the time, or just being too lazy to. I’m not saying that all are like this, as some do work out regularly, but most don’t.
– too disorganised, especially if they work full or part time and/or also study, when it comes to getting their shit together and committing to regularly meet up, irrespective whether they have shared, or full custody. Having full custody of their kid/s for a single mother is fairly rare.
A few single mothers I was supposed meet for coffee, stood me up without letting me know and if their fucking kid/s get sick, they won’t meet up.
AlphaOmega
Posted at 07:22 am, 25th July 2019I only met 2 single mothers for at least a date, one of them was a very good FB for quite a while but totally unreliable and total mess in her life but the sex and her sex drive were amazing. The other one I had just one date with and she behaved like an 18 year old virgin whos scared of dating. Yeah, I know it’s a mess. I would say they are fun as long as you don’t have any expectations / don’t rely on them for sex. It’s more like a bonus.
Caleb Jones
Posted at 12:39 pm, 25th July 2019Women 10+ years younger than you. So if you’re 37, “younger women” for you would be women age 27 and below.
Correct. Tinder is one of the exceptions.
Ha! That’s like asking for the best way to find dates with women with brown hair. Approximately 50% of women are single mothers. No special site or app needed; they’re everywhere (and will continue to grow).
johnnybegood
Posted at 02:56 pm, 25th July 2019I knew Tinder would be top. It’s ubiquitous across countries, and is the most widely used. Therefore, by math alone, OF COURSE it will the top.
Things notoriously missing:
Effort to meet ratio.
Premium membership effect on meetup ratio.
Quality of girls on there meeting with you.
Competition (well this would be speculative).
But maybe this is too complicated.
Coffee Meets Bagel for me personally is much easier than Tinder in the US because it doesn’t foster a “swipe 1,000 times for an hour” mindset among men and women. For me personally, I get laid more easily.
In Russia, as an American, Tinder is awesome. Because there, I’m considered a 10. (I assume Tinder is great for very, very attractive people). That’s because you have an endless tap of ass, and 50% of swipes are matches, so you don’t need to be swiping 1,000 profiles like the other losers (lol jk, I’m but an average man).
Bumble, well, last I used it in Chicago, it was warpig central.
Then, probably, there are apps out that are superior, and secret.
Really, the ideal app is where: the male competition sucks, there’s a high ratio of women, and particularly, a high ratio of hot women. It behooves one not to blast this app online however as all the male chodes march in (okay I’m no better than any other). I’m not aware of such apps, maybe Hinge, but it encourages the mindset of looking around and not “following the crowd.” It’s all about arbitrage and inefficient markets. That way I can get my wick wet with women typically above my league.
Again in Russia in particular (Germany/ France not the same) — it was crazy to see my phone explode with 1000+ Tinder matches.
I don’t know how hot women feel, but at that point, you only message the very hot ones, and don’t even notice who doesn’t respond. And you’re forced to use the same openers/ entire script. (Canned Opener Joke) — (So you’re from [City]? [City joke]) — What do you for fun? Drink? — haha (basic attempt at repeating what they said to indicate I’m humanoid) — Let me know if you want to hang out or get a drink sometimes. How bout X or Y. My WhatsApp is XXX-YYY-ZZZZ (great system to move to WhatsApp, now all my hot leads are on there).
It would be nice to live there for a while if the government wasn’t insane.
AlphaOmega
Posted at 04:25 am, 26th July 2019Well, it might soon be less insane than most of the west. It is already almost that way.
POB
Posted at 06:09 am, 26th July 2019I’ll repeat what I said:
(I usually save it for my last picture, but it increases your odds with all ages);
I don’t care what betas do…I care about what works. Pictures with pets do increase your odds of compliance (unless you’re going for a more bad boyish style, or if you don’t look masculine enough, but that’s another subject).
It’s my last image, so who cares? She probably already formed a picture of me in her head from the 5-6 images that came before, and the dog picture is there as a last straw so she can categorize me as a “safe dude”. I’ve run the tests with and without it…it works.
Guys usually think they have to go above and beyond and be completely opposite than everybody else to have success. No, they don’t. Good pictures and tight texting is everything to get her in front of you…no need to reinvent the wheel.
AlphaOmega
Posted at 06:17 am, 26th July 2019I don’t know why you think it’s a good idea to have that many pictures on there. If they are very similar then it doesn’t add anything and if they are different it’s likely decreasing your match chances.
A
Posted at 09:20 am, 26th July 2019Question about ‘Putting in the Numbers’ :
How, exactly, does one use Mail Merge, or some other automation tool, to send out 1000+ seemingly custom messages when you subscribe to a site? Others have mentioned this upthread, but how do you do it?
Pseudonymous User
Posted at 10:04 am, 26th July 2019It’s hard to outdo a government whose response to the Magnitsky Act is to ban adoption of its orphans by US families.
klkl
Posted at 09:17 am, 27th July 2019https://www.dailywire.com/news/49945/she-verbally-consented-sex-school-determined-he-ashe-schow
This is not, or is soon not being any longer, 2% stuff.
C Lo
Posted at 11:19 pm, 27th July 2019When I was in college, I had three rules:
1. Nobody bigger than a size six
2. Nobody younger than twenty, preferably a junior.
3. No psychology majors
It’s probably good advice still if you wanna avoid the overtly crazy, fat, or flakey ones on college campuses.
AlphaOmega
Posted at 03:05 am, 29th July 2019I think the school is about to get banged hardcore by the guy’s lawyer who is about to get to much money he will not need to work for the rest of his life. Sounds like a conspiracy, the girl and the guy probably made an agreement to play a prank on the school with the laugh that on the off chance they do go through with it they’d be rich. Guess who’s laughing now.
AlphaOmega
Posted at 03:07 am, 29th July 2019I don’t know what that is but it doesn’t sound like its something important or something most people in fact would care about. Just watch the news sometimes and you will see way more crazy stuff western governments do increasingly. So yeah, it’s pretty easy and it’s gonna get worse.
Pancake Mouse
Posted at 07:01 pm, 29th July 2019I missed the survey, but the San Francisco data checks out. Tinder is king here, Bumble is second, Hinge is a distant third (if you like dating boring professional chicks), everything else is pretty much useless.
ManOfTheTimes
Posted at 07:07 pm, 4th August 2019I think some of the ‘sphere vets and BD may have touched on this but sexual arbitrage is a legit goal for Alpha 2.0-leaning men to aspire toward. Some years ago, I would get decent traction on sites like Match, OKCupid and SeekingArrangment (now Seeking) and even Seeking (!!!) is not returning any tangible results (in my area, Washington, D.C.) without immediate $500 requests from fatties and old women. Meanwhile, in Colombia, ColombianCupid and Seeking are like shooting fish in the proverbial barrel. Daygame is occasionally fruitful but working hard on fitness, fashion and lifestyle so I can net a short-haired 30+ year old 6/10 is NOT what I call a good return on investment.
Gary
Posted at 03:21 pm, 26th August 2019I’ve never had much luck with plenty of fish. I hardly get any matches and of the ones that I do, the women are horrendous. I was once matched with a 40+ year old post wall fatty with tattoos, purple hair and kids!!! Clearly she was out of her mind with her expectations.
I have a love/hate relationship with Tinder. Sometimes it can be decent while other times, a complete waste of time.
Lately since upping my photo game, I’ve been getting some girls messaging me directly on instagram. I can see how this could be turned into a dating app if you have great looking and interesting photos. Also having a lot of followers will make you seem popular to the ladies.
Lazy Blitz, a Storm of Openers!
Posted at 08:01 am, 4th November 2019This article is instructive for usage data and cites various studies:
https://www.businessofapps.com/data/tinder-statistics/