How Hollywood Poisons Your Relationships
One of my recurring themes is how false Societal Programming continually damages your life by filling your subconscious mind with a constant array of sweet-sounding bullshit that compels you to engage in all the wrong decisions and actions for your life; decisions and actions that cause long-term pain and suffering for both you and those around you.
I’ve also talked about how Hollywood is one of the key sources of false Societal Programming, and how it insidiously shapes your opinions regarding everything from sex to politics and economics. Not least of these things is Disney, defined in my glossary thusly:
Disney – Any thought derived from societal programming that monogamy, child rearing, or traditional marriage is pleasant and/or permanent in the modern era. Disney is usually suffered by women, but a certain variation can be suffered by men as well (see: Guy-Disney).
…as well as Guy-Disney, defined as:
Guy-Disney – The incorrect thought men have that somewhere out there is a girl who will love you forever, never cheat on you, never get bored with you, and never break up with you.
I’ve talked about Disney and Guy-Disney to death, but there’s another aspect of Hollywood Societal Programming that is just as damaging, if not more so.
I’m about to summarize the plot of every romance or romantic comedy movie ever made. Here we go:
1. Girl meets Boy.
2. Girl is skinny, quirky, highly intelligent, and pretty but not too pretty; not pretty enough to alienate the women in the audience (she’s “just right”). She is either a Strong Independent Woman Who Doesn’t Need A Man™, or a Nice Girl Who Just Can’t Find The Right Guy™.
3. Boy is either an asshole, a loser, arrogant, creepy, emotionally distant, or severely problematic in some other way. Dangerous Bad Boy™, Cold Distant Businessman™, and Rude Arrogant Insensitive Smartass™ are usually the most common types of Boys that Girls encounters in the Hollywood world.
4. Girl and Boy have immediate conflict and don’t get along. Arguments and problems.
5. Boy softens and starts to like Girl. Girl and Boy have sex, or make out, and/or start dating. Passion and romance.
6. Three-fourths into the movie, a big problem occurs, usually Boy’s fault. Boy and Girl separate. Girl cries. Very sad.
7. At almost the end of the movie, Girl and Boy get back together at the very last minute. Everything is happy; Girl and Boy live happily ever after. (Marriage or living together is usually stated or implied.)
Most of you might be thinking that the problem I’m referring to above is that everything shows how great the girl is and how shitty the boy is. True, that’s a problem, but we men have been portrayed as either assholes, pussies, or retards in movies, TV shows, and commercials for over 20 years now. It sucks, but it’s certainly nothing new, and everyone is aware of it, even women.
What I’m referring to is something much more insidious and effective, since your conscious mind can’t see it, but your subconscious can. It is this:
Hollywood trains you to believe that courting is the hard part and the long-term relationship is the easy part, when in fact the reality is the exact opposite.
Hollywood teaches you that courting a new lover is an absolute nightmare. If he’s man he’ll be a liar, player, jerk, utter beta male pussy, lazy pot smoker, or a total dumbass. If she’s a woman, she’ll be dingy, bitchy, overly emotional, a stalker, or flat-out psychotic during the initial phases of the relationship.
During the initial phases of meeting or dating someone new, according to Hollywood, it’s nothing but pure chaos and emotional ups and downs. It’s one huge problem after the next. Lots of arguments, crying, conflict, and mixed emotions. It’s just terrible.
Then, if you’re able to survive all of this horror, something wonderful happens. You both suddenly love each other, stay with each other in perfect bliss, and everything is wonderful forever. All the work is over, and now you finally get rewarded for all of your suffering. You and your new lover Live Happily Ever After™.
That all sounds familiar because you’ve seen it in movies so many times, but have you actually experienced it in real life?
Highly unlikely. Because the reality is literally the exact opposite.
Once you find someone you like and who at least somewhat likes you, and sexual activity occurs, you don’t have any problems whatsoever. It’s actually the opposite. You have NRE, the honeymoon period. This is the greatest, happiest, most enjoyable part of the relationship. NRE is the most powerful positive emotion a human being can feel. You both make each other feel euphoric. You’re desire for each other is almost like a drug addiction. You never argue because you’re not quite comfortable enough with each other to do that yet, nor do you even want to. The other person is so “wonderful.” Everything is new and exciting.
(There are exceptions to this of course, like when people do one night stands on each other, but I’m not talking about that. I’m talking about something new but ongoing, as demonstrated in these stupid Hollywood movies.)
Then, when you finally settle down into a real relationship (or marriage), NRE ends, as it always does.
Then what happens?
Then the problems start. Arguments. Disagreements. Demands. Drama. Sexual boredom. Cheating. Jealousy.
It used to be great, but now the relationship is work.
The phase that Hollywood tells you is the fun easy part, the “reward,” is actually when the work and sacrifice truly begin. It takes no work to be happy with someone when they’re new and you’re both in NRE. That’s easy. What’s hard is when NRE wears off and you’re still together. It’s even harder if you now live together. It’s even harder again if you have children.
The path Hollywood lays out for you is literally the exact opposite of what actually happens at every phase for most people. This is why you have millions of people, if not billions, who think that “courtship is supposed to be hard” and “relationships and marriage are supposed to be easy.” NO! Courtship is (usually) easy and immensely enjoyable, and most serious, long-term relationships require a great deal of work and bullshit.
Of course, nonmonogamous relationships are far less work and involve far less drama, sacrifice, and time than monogamy and/or monogamous marriage, but even nonmonogamous relationships require a degree of effort to do correctly, particularly in the earlier phases. They also follow the same pattern of dating, NRE courtship, and “relationship.”
As always, the first defense against false Societal Programming is to be aware of it whenever you see it. The next time you see a movie that demonstrates that courtship is a nightmare but long-term relationships or marriage are easy bliss, remember that you’re being fed a line of bullshit designed to make the women in the audience feel an entertaining range of emotions (which is exactly what women crave). You’re not seeing something even remotely accurate to real-world human behavior.
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Great article, really hits the nail on the head.
As an aside, one of the things that drives me nuts about the type of movie you’ve described is the inevitable hyper-speed betaization of any male lead who started out as an Alpha. If a man emulates in real life what he’s seen play out on the movie screen, it will be a surefire recipe to prematurely end NRE and kill the woman’s sexual attraction for him.
Once awakened there is no turning back, women are still very into this crap, girl movies, i believe from what i see with my own eyes and been hearing for the past 10 years.
Attraction, passion love this part last a mere 3 months if you are lucky the rest well, in today world a long term relationship ends at around the 5 year mark, when people are lucky. And most of the time the women dumps the man because she found her soul mate elsewhere, and we stupid men regret all the time spent with her because she gave us bad sex, was very selfish and at the end we get half of the house money, and after a few months we thank life that another loser is dealing with her and realize we are far better living alone with pets.
I am 45 been dating women ever since i was 18 the best part was sex, the rest was just not worth it, even at my age i still train it the gym and am active, most women i have met are lazy, and at some point will end up fat, have kids and let themselves become ugly, they live true there kids and life slips by.
Either it be online dating or live meeting women between 35-50 over estimate there value, ho and don’t get me wrong, i have been turned down called ugly and so much more by those frustrated whores, but i guess that the way life goes. Those women with life experience still think that they can attract the total package, and eventually give up because they see that they have nothing to offer to get what they want, cellulite, sagging boobs and mommy tummies…. but i used to be so hot, well baby you are not anymore HA.
I am going on 5 years single, i was a good man loved my ex took care of here never cheated while she was the selfish one, bad sex, awful in bed, self centered, what the hell, and then social programing kicks in and people tell you there is no prefect relationship, but why do us men need to endure this, give and get none in return.
I got back on my feet after my separation, lost the weight got back in shape, i had this illusion that at 41 back then i would only be happy with a women by my side then i started dating again, and that hit me straight in the face, women are independent and not ready to invest themselves lots live in the past, and so on. In other word women even at 40 and 50 are confused and mixed up and don’t know what they want, that is the world today that we live in.
Some people are lucky to meet good people invest and there relationship works, for me i have given enough, i do not believe in this crap anymore i have close all my online dating accounts after meeting fakes, lyres, women with dead end jobs with nothing to offer, and i have also been turned down, and more….. at some point my confidence was very low……… but i am back up now and more awake then ever.
At 45 i never had kids no family i realize i am far better living alone with my cats, i cook for myself, i still play amazing video games, go for walks alone have some friends i go out with and more, i have shaken that stupid needy crap, the need to be with someone, and the tough that i need a women to be happy, after all there is internet porn which is so much better then all that i have met in the last 4 years at least they get a rise out of me.
Learn the MGTOW and Alpha male life its the best life ever keep fit, look amazing, dress well groom well and feel amazing 1 life to live there is no way to be miserable and unhappy with a women that gives you so little.
Human Mind. Again.. is your Greatest Asset.
It can serve you or rather make you suffer.
If you focus your attention and deliberately observe the internal aspect of it, it will show how most of your reality isn’t something you perceive; it’s something you create in your mind.
When you start to became aware of it, you’ll see how outside influence can manifest into your mind, so instead you will witness reality for just what it is.
-The biggest stumbling block is INSIDE, work it out first. After then everything else is secondary.
I think that Guy-Disney is at least as prevalent as Girl-Disney in Northern Europe.
While many girls are suffering from Disney mentality, almost all of the Northern European men are stuck in a completely blue-pill mentality regarding women. Even the players/PUAs have a hardcore belief that they will get married and have lots of tiny babies and live happily ever after. Many women, having seen that 90 % of Scandinavian men are complete beta pussies, are actively rejecting the fantasy, at least until they hit The Wall.
You often claim that preaching polyamory to Europeans is easy, but trust me, it is not. I’m openly polyamorous when people ask, but I’ve only had one friend truly accept it (and appreciate it for himself when he discovered the benefits!). Saying that you want to remain nonmarried and babyless is considered blasphemy (in the most atheist part of the world, I might add).
Great post as always , real quick …any list of example movies?.I will research but I’m sure there are tons …thanks
Interesting article. Another example, just happened to me.
Great NRE, relationship passes the one year mark. Girl starts complaining about “emotional distance”, yet everything else is going just fine. No arguments for the first year turns into weekly debates about what a man “should be doing” to make a lady happy.
Girl gets antsy, can’t get out of her own head. Finally breaks it off, says she wants “Movie Star love” by which I would guess is the same “Hollywood love” story that’s been programmed into her head since birth, schlub beta who simply bows to her every little wish and whim and tells her how great she is day in and day out forever.
Made of Honor was one that immediately came to mind for me, absolutely cringeworthy..
It’s funny, I’ve actually heard girls say to me “I thought you would chase after me like they do in the movies” when they break it off after I won’t bend to their beta commands and wishes.
I’d say the most recent example is that 50 shades of grey movie-the very average looking and boring girl snags one of the richest, best looking, sexually dominant Alphas and goes on to beta-ize him.
Love Actually is also pretty awful too.
I thought 50 days of summer was educational for severe beat guys who get oneitis easily. I did like that they didn’t end up together and thought it was a more realistic portrayal of a relationship. The only bad part was the very end since they allude to him just making the same damn choices again after going through this painful experience. Just keep trying!
BD, what about the Girl With A Troubled Past™? Jack here has said he has no tolerance for low self-esteem women, what would you say?
Funny but my experience so far has been kinda aligned with the movies – dating is quite hard but once I do get somewhere with a girl its pretty easy. But then maybe thats because I was always kind inclined to do what I want, being very independent, and dont listen to the girls demands so I dont care if she asks for something and it turns out maybe they find that attractive. Just gotta work on the dating part still, I guess.
As for the portrayal thing I have found if you do wanna watch some romance go for Japanese anime. Its completely different style than western. Often very cute and sweet but also often bad endings (or very bad endings… like lots of blood and violence) and the guy often is totally distant and self absorbed or ignorant and all the girls are hitting on him whilst he doesnt care/notice. Also unrealistic but often makes me lough out loud, unlike the Holywood stuff which puts me to sleep or makes me cringe.
The biggest thing about Hollywood that disturbs me is that its been pushing a narrative pretty much since forever that all chicks can be won over by white knighting and catching one-itis for them. To me its actually worse than treating them as sex objects because yeah if you view chicks as sex objects that’s a pretty sleazy thing to do but its negligible in most cases.
Placing one solitary chick on a pedestal I argue is even worse because it puts more pressure on a chick vs. treating chicks like sex objects which is only really dangerous if acted on. And even then its only dangerous if it involves sexual violence, which I argue many boys with one-itis probably do as well but we never hear about it.
I do believe that long-term relationships are hard and take work, but as a woman, I believe courting is pretty challenging too! I found that dating was a nightmare and often wished I could have by-passed it. I had wished I could have gone straight to the relationship part so I didn’t have to sift through the bad apples to finally get to a good one to actually date. I could write a book about what a nightmare it was to date through my 20’s and 30’s. I don’t know if guys feel dating is a nightmare, but from a woman’s prospective, it’s definitely challenging.
I think for many men, it’s hard for them to comprehend the world of online dating from a woman’s perspective. As far as a guy is concerned, women have it made. They have the choice of the litter. All they have to do is get online every day, sitting on their princess throne and file through the dozens or more profiles of men who have messaged them throughout the day. They then flippantly toss out all of those well thought out, carefully crafted messages from most of those poor schmucks, and then they log onto their Facebook accounts to complain to their girlfriends that there are no “good men” left in the world. Unfortunately, the reality is nowhere near that fantasy. I found that the majority of the emails I received were one liners or just said one word, “hot.” I have experienced many men on dates who had no manners, would show up late, and were rude to the waiter. Often I found that men would try to take me back to their place to fuck even before I pull out the chair to the bar for a drink (At least wait until the second date!).
As a woman, you are a dime a dozen and competing with unknown competition. (Maybe men feel the same?) You can be pretty, funny, and intelligent but it still won’t be enough to get a man to call you back or take you out to dinner 75% of the time. In a sex-fueled society, how does a nice girl meet a decent guy? Guys, vice versa.
On Match.com, I remember my inbox was flooded with dozens of messages each day. But trust me, I couldn’t really go out with most of the guys that sent those messages, as many of them would not respond back. Some of the messages were from men who sent my best friend the same exact messages, often minutes apart. Guys frequently spam girls with the same message hoping it’s enough to garner a response. I had activated and deactivated the accounts so many times due to frustration and found that the same guys still attempted to message me months later not even realizing they already tried and in-fact used the same message they used before. Ah, good ol’ copy and paste. Often times, when I would write guys back, they just had short responses but never asked to go on a date. The guys that I did manage to get dates with, well that’s all it was, entertainment.
Let me take you back to the days when men had enough nerve to approach a woman. Men had the courage to think of something clever, walk over to a woman, and flirt with her in the middle of the day. Both men and women exchanged phone numbers, and what happened next was that the man was forced to call a woman on the phone. He had to talk to her, communicate with her. No shortcuts. No texting or emailing or anything. Nowadays our endless amount of choices, make us feel like there’s so many options, we can’t even commit to a date. We’re always looking for the next best thing. Today’s society is as confused as ever. Choice is just an illusion for both men and women.
Whether you are a man or a women, dating can be overwhelming, challenging and really just a pain in the ass! I don’t think Hollywood is trying to deceive anyone based on my prior experience in the dating world.
These Disney fantasy chick flicks make me nauseous. The storyline is atrocious and predictable. The dialogue is boring at best. And the worst part… complete lack of critical thinking.
I refuse to watch that shit.
Wow, couldn’t agree more. The depiction of courtship and relationships is so consistently off from real life it’s just ridiculous and has set a lot of people up from both genders for completely unrealistic expectations.
I don’t disagree with many of your other points but internet porn will not make you long-term happy. I strongly advise you brush up on your younger woman game or sugar daddy game.
I have literally never said this. I have said the Europeans are more sex-positive than Americans, and have a better understanding that long-term monogamy doesn’t work (thus the Mediterranean marriage, etc).
Regardless, you’re not talking about Europeans. You’re talking about Scandinavians. Yikes. Yes, maintaining a long-term MLTR / FB lifestyle in Scandinavia would indeed be a huge pain in the ass. As I’ve said before, when societies become too left-wing, women become bitchy and intolerant of alternate lifestyles. (Just another one in the long list of reasons why I would never live in Scandinavia. Beautiful place to visit though; it’s on my to-visit list.)
Pick any of the movies shown in the graphic at the top of this article. Or seriously, Google “romantic comedies” and pick any one of them at random. Again, I’m serious.
Those women are usually portrayed in dramas, not rom coms.
I would say that’s insane, since women who have low-esteems make fantastic FB‘s.
Also remember that Jack is leans heavily in the Alpha 1.0 direction.
Then your experience is not aligned with the movies. Once you get somewhere the movies say it’s a nightmare, not “pretty easy.”
Dating is different than courting though. Dating can be a nightmare for certain people, particularly women over 33. But courting, once you find a guy you like and who likes you, is almost always easy. More than easy.
Haha! I’ve done that!
Yes, that would be me. 🙂
Copy and paste kicks ass. Though yeah, on a site like Match.com with lots of provider hunters, it’s not as effective. I’ve told guys who focus on those kinds of sites to customize their openers, at least a little bit.
Well, now, those guys are fucking it up. Idiots.
Yep, that’s part of the problem. Though women take advantage of this as much or more than men do. (Younger women anyway.)
Sorry, but I don’t see anything wrong with that. If a girl I messaged twice in the same month or year flat-out tells me not to do it again, I’ll stop, but until then I see nothing wrong with trying my luck a second time after some weeks or months. Similarly, the very low response rates online nowadays often mean you can’t afford not to use some copypasting, though I do customize and/or read the girl’s full profile now and then. We’re talking about literally hundreds of openers for one lay.
I don’t disagree, but at the same time I’ve always found it a bit supplicating (is that the word ? not a native english speaker) to approach a woman who, on average, has perhaps a 10% chance of even being in the mood to be flirted with, before we even get to whether she’d be interested in me in particular. Online at least, it’s understood that everyone is here specifically for dating (though, of course, lately many people are just attention whoring). Hey, if there were real life “forums” or something, were people gather specifically to flirt, I’m in. The rough equivalent of this that does exist is bars/clubs, and night game has big drawbacks that have been discussed here in the past.
Propaganda regarding relationships does brainwash minds. My earliest mind imprints for relationships from around age four to five that I still remember the days they happened was with a cousin and we took a flower saying “she loves me/not,” singing “first comes love, then marriage, then carriage,” a record with a read-along book where on the last page was a drawing of the cartoon man and the cartoon woman getting married, The Lady and The Tramp, a tv show where the reason for the implied sex was because they were cold so I thought the reason for sex was to warm up when freezing, and when I used a genius technique to get a girl and myself nude (that rarely any PUAs today mention) while playing and that was fun until her parents walked in. Many now think being an Alpha male is being mean to women, but it’s better to be an Alpha male who is slightly playful with women because a slight playful vibe easily transitions into touching and a sexual vibe. Another humorous mental imprint later on the song “hurts so good” made me think ejaculation was going to hurt but “hurt so good.”
Religion (organized by the Roman Empire in the 300’s AD to pacify/control the citizens) continues to promote the propaganda untruths that “sex is for marriage only/have to be married to have sex,” that poisons the minds of billions of people into being brainwashed with these false beliefs. Going back beyond five thousand years ago and everyone today is a descendant of people who were NOT married.
Almost all relationships on tv shows and movies from the 1940’s to 2017 are either sappy love romances/traditional monogamous marriage propaganda/or something bad about sex. It’s not easy even in 2017 to find many genuinely erotic/pro-sexuality movies. I bought all three “50 Shades” books and the writing was so awful it was a struggle to read to page 50 (and I’m someone who one of my passions is reading and I’m in the process of within the next ten years reading over one thousand books and I like erotica books), then I stopped for a month and looked up the ending to decide if I wanted to struggle through them and when I discovered the “50 Shades series” ends in marriage I threw them out. Love is something that neither men nor women “really” care about as “love” is not a prime motivator in relationships, no matter what hollywood type media incessantly promotes, and women just go along with it because of pressure from family/peers and they get further benefits out of a “loving marriage” such as a house (and for celebrities tens of millions in a divorce).
Every day in the news is something about sex being bad with “criminals/crimes”, so there “needs to be more laws further regulating sex.” In 2017 there’s daily relationship/marriage propaganda in the news; “Married Men Live Longer,” “People Who Are Not Married Are Depressed,” “Marriage Is Good For Your Heart,” “Study Proves Marriage Makes Men Happier,” “Celebrities Living In Wedded Bliss,” “Married Men Make More Money.” Commercials in 2017 are often about a wedding ring equals love, buy this car to protect your children, buy an expensive house for your family, this is what people in a relationship/family looks like and these are the products they buy, people who are married get a discount on this insurance. Dating sites saying they have the most marriages (as if that’s the ultimate objective). Movies where people who have casual sex are bad/unhappy, and people who are married are good/happy. Most of those are advertising tactics (Identity/Self-Image based marketing) to create/agitate/exaggerate a problem, and a person is not good enough, or this is the societal programmed lifestyle you should be living (the matrix is basically the socially conditioned perspective of what is reality), so the solution to the made-up problem is to buy the ring/car/house/product that fits in with their (religion/govt/media) views of how relationships are “supposed to be” in order for them to remain in control. You don’t have to go along with it.
BD, I need to slap your girl around a little bit, but I’m doing it within the confines of your rules, so don’t kill me, okay? Refute me yourself also if you want, but I ask you to let her stand up for herself (#equality) because my criticisms are legitimate, not mindless rage. So please, give me a little breathing room to flesh out my disgust with what your girl just said and ask her my questions. I would appreciate it.
[Jack rolls up sleeves]
You talk as if you have little experience with “courting.” The more people you’ve slept with, the less overwhelming the process becomes.
LOL! Don’t you think you should at least fuck the guy for a while before delving into the serious shit? Just to make sure you’re sexually compatible and that he’s your type?
Having sex quickly speeds up this process and gets men to reveal their true colors a lot faster. Ever thought of that? Also, what are your thoughts about sleeping with multiple men?
What exactly was so horrible about it?
Vice versa.
Correct.
Well said.
Oh wait, you were being sarcastic?
Ah, brevity!
Wait what? Waiter? So you enjoy going to fancy places on your initial dates? Why? And who paid?
So what’s the problem?
WHY?????????
Dinner? Why dinner? Did Caleb take you out to dinner during the pre-sex phase? I doubt it. What’s with all this traditional horseshit? And what do you mean by “take you out?” You mean pay? Tell me again how you believe that women aren’t sitting on their princess thrones? Slower this time, so I can fully relish your hypocrisy.
If you’re both adults, you should meet as equals and split the bill. No one has any business taking out the other one. You should have your own money and job.
Ah slut shaming! Are you suggesting that our society being “sex-fueled” is a negative? What do you mean by “nice girl?” You mean a prude, right? And what do you mean by “decent guy?” You mean a beta male nice guy who will pay like a castrated chump and lick your ass, right?
Better question: How does anyone meet someone decent in a society that is NOT sex fueled? You want to go back to the 1950s when dating was a formal affair with bullshit rituals and chivalrous pretensions? What exactly do you hate about our society being “sex fueled?” What is “indecent” about a man who wants to fuck you? And what is “not nice” about a woman who wants to fuck the man?
I fuck them as fast as I can. That’s how. You learn so much about the other person’s psychology during sex.
Yuck! Religious/traditional cesspool!
What’s wrong with that? If a man has to send several hundred messages before getting even one date, do you actually believe you are worth customization?
And your problem with that is?
Your boyfriend doesn’t distinguish himself in this matter. In fact, he doesn’t really distinguish himself from any of the things you claim to hate. Unless you want to say that he “took you out” to a fancy dinner on the first few dates? Did he?
Here’s a fucked up idea: WHY DON’T YOU ASK?
With their money, I’d bet.
Why would we want that? How about you develop enough nerve to approach us once in a while. How does that feel?
Yeah, until feminists started putting us in prison for criminal sexual harassment.
Can I ask you a question? Why do you hate convenience? If a woman is on an online dating site, I already know what she wants, so I’m not risking embarrassment or wasting my time. Why do you oppose this? Why do you expect me to waste my time flirting with a woman on the street who may not even be in dating mode?
Why do you want to force men to do all the work? Seriously, why? Maybe you can pull some of your own weight?
Why are you against shortcuts and conveniences? Texting and emailing is also talking.
Bullshit! It is infinitely easier to get laid today than in your 1950s hell. Thanks largely to online game.
Not if you do it enough times
Oh. My. God.
So not only have you completely disagreed with virtually every word that your boyfriend wrote in this article, but you are asserting that all those movies where the geek gets the girl, the friendzone nice guy gets laid, the woman ignores the jerk, the jerk eventually becoming a betaized wimp (a la Cruel Intentions), and the morbidly obese cow getting the guy to think she’s beautiful (a la Shallow Hal) is…..realistic? Really?
Let me put that into a larger context for you:
I have no tolerance for about 80-90 percent of the female population. The reason is simple:
Extremely sex-positive, high sex drive, and super open-minded/insatiable women have spoiled me and completely ruined me for most women. There is no way I can ever go back to average or mainstream women with their medium sex drives and awkward pseudo-traditional inclinations.
To replenish my fuck buddy numbers, I recently went on a first date with a woman (the ex-girlfriend of my girlfriend’s current main male fuck buddy) who told me she broke up with my girlfriend’s fuck buddy because he wanted to get her into a threesome with her and her best friend.
Needless to say, I’ll never see that girl again. And it’s not because I necessarily want to have a threesome with her and her best friend. I don’t. Rather, it’s because I find myself no longer capable of tolerating mainstream attitudes, because they are a major turn off just in and of themselves, regardless of what I want or don’t want from that specific girl.
I think I’m doomed to completely confine my sex life to the open/poly community, with married/taken cheaters being the only exception that I will indulge (since they dump all of their mainstream hang ups on their primary partners and leave me their pure lust).
But I don’t feel any scarcity because this minority female personality is really easy to recognize once you have experience with the type. And they love sharing their men. Once you fuck them well, you have good references and they’ll pass you around between their friends. Most of those friends are open/poly themselves, but some cheat or have a “don’t ask, don’t tell” relationship with their primary partners. And the girl who is hooking you up has various subtle ways of informing you about the level of discretion that is appropriate for the specific girl in question that she’s introducing you to. It’s great.
So as long as I’m sexually satisfied (and there is no sign of this changing any time soon), mainstream women can kiss my ass. It seems that once you’re in the poly group/secret society, the girls never let you go. They make sure you’re sexually taken care of by others in their social network even if they are no longer fucking you themselves. It is a truly incredible world!
Your definition of “low self esteem” is broader than mine. I meant that I have no tolerance for women who declare war against their own selves and their own desires via internalized slut shaming and a suppression of their own urges for the sake of peer pressure or mainstream acceptance.
I need a woman who owns herself and regularly tells society to take a hike. I can’t stand girls who want to do something but don’t because they are “too scared” of looking in the mirror afterwards.
Here’s an example from your life, BD: You said that women have refused to have sex with you despite desperately wanting to, and texted you saying that they rushed home after the date so they can masturbate. That would fill me with rage. If a woman says no to me, it better be because she doesn’t want me. That’s understandable. But if a woman says no, despite wanting me badly, she is wasting her own time and mine due to pointless social pressure. I have no respect for such low self esteem women and want them nowhere near my life. At least women who say no to me because I’m unattractive to them, I can respect.
BD, do other people being less happy than you sometimes bring your mood down?
My problem is that I’m an extremely kinesthetic person. Some have even called me a pseudo-empath. What this means is that I pick up on the vibes of people in real life (this doesn’t apply on the Internet), and if that energy is radically different from my own, it affects my own vibe in a negative manner, pushing me even further to a more extreme introvert mode.
My solution: Hang out with people with a similar energy, vibe, and outlook on life to my own. This necessitates some alpha 1.0 tendencies because I have to care about other people’s mental states and mental energy (off the Internet) in my personal circle, at least to a certain extent, so that I can have a good time with them. Their mental atmosphere effects me, which is why I’m conscientious about sticking with “my own kind” so to speak, especially where sex is involved.
No doubt, nearly all Hollywood romance movies and romantic comedies are horrible schlock. The only thing worse, their European versions. I recall a French film I endured to make a girl happy because it was her “absolute favorite movie!” Basically, a couple falls in love. He proposes and brings his new fiancé to meet his family. She turns out to be a miserable whore and they break up. The end. Two hours of awful relationship drama between a beta male and bitchy alpha female on film. Why, oh why would anyone make THAT into a movie?!
Some notes I made a while ago:
tv and movie propelled myths
people’s personalities match their looks
there’s no social anxiety, awkward silences
most people are super attractive
people say what they mean
people don’t look at who they’re talking to
most people are witty
women make the first move
where are the risks?
aggressive vs assertive
how romance starts, just talk about it?
no realism
it’s all about the drama
Anyone is allowed to disagree with anyone on this blog as long as they follow the five rules. PF is allowed to disagree with me just as much as you’re allowed to disagree with her. The problem is you’re already on the edge of getting banned and you’ve used up all of your warnings, which means if you break any of the rules, even once, you’re banned forever, and you’ll lose your shit, and I won’t care. So far you’ve stayed within the rules. With your emotional outbursts, we’ll see how long that lasts.
And these women don’t bother me at all as long as they have sex with me by date two or so. Granted, most of them do not, so I move on. It’s all part of the numbers game (as well as usually avoiding women over 33).
I need women who are hot and low-drama. That’s it. Much easier.
I know it does. That’s because you’re an overly emotional guy with poor emotional control who is a more sex positive version of an Alpha Male 1.0. When that happened to me, it didn’t “fill me with rage.” I just laughed, shook my head, and moved to the next woman on the list.
Just about everyone is less happy than me (if we’re talking about how often they’re happy) so the answer is no.
Of course if someone is giving me drama they get soft nexted, but that’s different from being unhappy.
Actually I think your problem is that you have anger issues, but that’s only a guess. (You’re now going to tell me that you’re a super happy person and never get mad in real life and you’re only a hyper rage monster on internet. Pardon me if I find this unlikely.)
I actually have an article coming up on women’s energy and how it affects you (and her). Coming soon.
No it doesn’t. I have the same desire yet I don’t have a drip of Alpha 1.0. If I don’t like someone, I simply don’t spend time with them (hard or soft next). And I don’t get angry about it. If I like someone, I spend more time with them. Problem solved, no anger, no commands, no rage. I suggest you try it sometime (though I know you won’t).
@Gil Galad
The dating website I was on was Match.com. Many woman on Match are not looking to get laid, they are looking for a relationship.
I always customized my emails. Most women I know also customize, so it’s nice to hear that you do now and again. I do agree that sometimes people’s profiles are way too long to read!
I agree with you!
Haha, sure, go for it!
I beg to differ. Your comments appear to come from a place of rage and anger. You seem to have trouble excepting that others have different opinions than you. Feel free to disagree with me but my opinions are based on past experiences.
@Pink Firefly
To your point about dating being a bit of a nightmare for women, I would say it’s often because of the way they approach dating, as more of a job interview instead of just having fun with it to see who you connect with and enjoy their company.
I’ve known plenty of women have endless lists of requirements for their guy and will bounce the minute he says one stupid thing.
Many also cherry pick these ideals from the old 50’s style of dating with post-feminism-they want the best of both worlds which you won’t find in this day and age.
One of the biggest lessons from this blog and similar ones is that we need to adapt to the reality of the world and not pine for days gone by or some utopian ideal we see in, ahem, Hollywood movies.
When I said “hundreds of openers for one lay”, I wasn’t just talking about casual sex. I’m not starting a serious relationship unless sex has occurred, obviously, so a serious relationship will also require hundreds of openers – but when I’m on an online dating site, first I’m looking for a girl who’ll have sex with me and then if I’m lucky to have a good connection with her and she’s low drama etc she’ll slowly climb up the way from FB towards something more. So the result remains the same: when I do online dating, I need hundreds of messages to get anywhere with a single woman (and “anywhere” always involves sex as a first step, hence “number of openers per lay”, regardless of whether she ends up a FB or OLTR) – and most other men do too. So yeah, reading every profile and customizing every message just isn’t affordable for us.
Girl is skinny, quirky, highly intelligent, and pretty but not too pretty; not pretty enough to alienate the women in the audience (she’s “just right”)
Alienate is Blackdragon’s kindly synonym for trigger their envy, I suppose 🙂
PF shows derision for successful male dating/mating strategies, but these are likely the ones that landed her her current boyfriend. More proof for the adoption of paying attention to what women do not what they say.
Your girlfriend PinkFirefly is cute Blackdragon haha (she’s a keeper, get rid of her fast bro). =))
Some womens opinions on this topic gives us living proof of how poisonous these movies really are 😉 I mean, these are not average Disney filled and gender myopic women.
They are women reading this blog, well aware af all these Alpha 2.0 concepts, even dating Alpha 2.0 men, even polyamorous. Still Hollywood wins from their their chick-logic point of view here.
BD already pointed this out a bit himself as did others but I’d really like to hear PF’s response because it seems indeed quite strange that literally every thing that she is complaining about regarding dating, are all literally bullet points on BD’s dating methodology, which he undoubtedly employed when approaching and dating her.
I’m definitely not pining for days gone by; lucky for me I don’t have to continue with the nightmares of dating. I found the person I had been looking for.
Nice try but you are incorrect. I found BD and messaged him initially. There were no one-liners or endless emails with no dates from him. He was respectful and I was very impressed with him during the first date. He was different than any of the other nightmare dates I had previously been on.
What proof did I give you to assume that?
Hollywood movies are terrible for this. I can’t count the number of times I’ve started watching a movie, initially captivates because the characters were amusing and the plot seemed interesting. Then, always just after the half way point, I realize I know exactly how the movie will end up and lose interest in it.
A lot of TV shows are bad for this as well. For example, I loved the first few seasons of How I met your Mother and thought Barney and Robin were awesome in their own ways. Then they started dating and suddenly Barney wasn’t as funny and Robin wasn’t as fun to watch either.
Agree. That show was a very weird mix of red pill (infrequent and often subtle) + extreme blue pill, but as it progressed, the latter became ever more dominant, and the show also got less and less funny. I finished it because it did manage to give me a few laughs every now and then. I even read the Bro Code, lol. What I did like was that in spite of the cringe-inducing bluepill broken record, the ending was actually kinda realistic: Ted the beta ends up “happy”-ish with an ordinary-looking chick, and Barney goes back to being a player after a brief marriage, which isn’t an implausible fate for a pua.
@Pink
I more or less agree with your points on dating from a woman’s perspective (although, as a guy, I just chuckle because they’re alien to me).
But in my experience younger women (<30 yo) do not think like you. Here’s a list of what they keep doing (no matter how good you are at online):
– flaking – ghosting – stalling – being late to dates – forgetting appointments – and so on.
On the other hand, girls between 32>39yo keep getting more and more like teenage drama queens with a huge list of demands. They could be great partners (not only sexual BTW) but their BS demeanor and absurd dating demands turn me off big time.
The point here is as long as you’re a hot woman, no matter your age, you’ll sure have A LOT of options – even if you do absolutely nothing. Guys on the other hand have to chase, apply game and navigate through some heavy BS to find the girls they like.
I’m not excusing the chodes by any means…as men it’s our duty to be respectful but also bold enough to get you naked on our beds. But as a hot woman who was once looking for a relationship you’ll agree it’s your job to search through those options, find a guy you like and don’t give him too much BS (like you did).
No disrespect but Pink Firefly’s POV is out there!
People are lazy. Women on these dating sites expect men to do all of the work. Men are lucky to have a woman message them first at all! But the few messages I’ve had women send me have all just said “hi”. Keep in mind these messages have been almost all from fat single mom’s who are nowhere close to being in my league. They’re punching up, and that’s the best they can do to catch my attention.
In any case at least you have people taking the initiative and reaching out to you. If you were a guy your inbox would be empty 98% of the time if you didn’t message women first.
And? There are rude people in both genders. I’m willing to bet men get flaked on at a much higher rate then women. When I schedule a date the woman flakes at the last minute 33%-66% of the time. If you call them out for their bad behavior they just block you and you never hear from them again. Because there are no social repercussions for their actions.
So what? Generally speaking a man’s prerogative is sex, and a woman’s prerogative is access to resources. I have no problem taking a woman out, having a good time, and paying for it all. But I only do that for people who have reciprocated by first giving me physical intimacy and shown themselves to be emotionally stable. Your statement sounds as ridiculous to a man as us saying to you: “Often I found women would try to make me pay for our date before I even knew their full name. At least wait until the second date!”
We do.
Because that’s the most effective tactic for a man. Any type of dating, but especially online dating; is like throwing your genitals at a wall. You have to send out 100’s of emails for just one bang. Trying to find someone who you’d have a relationship is even more difficult; because men have much higher standards for who’d they’d date then for who they’d bang.
If you don’t believe me try online dating as a man for yourself. Set up a profile with black dragons picture. See how much work it is to:create a profile, find someone in your league who’s interested in you, get their number, schedule a date, and get them to show up to your date spot. No cheating by using the picture of a male model (use photo’s of BD), or stealing Black Dragons profile & standard messages either. You have to come up with all of your material on your own. Just like the average guy would.
Trust me I’ve set up a female profile for an online dating site just to see what the other side is like, and it’s much easier.
It’s not about social repercussions. It’s about who they are and how they behave (especially when they are young and hot). “Chick logic” will always prevail no matter what. They’ll misbehave, rationalize their bullshit backwards and put the blame on anything but themselves (including you). That’s how they are.
We can’t judge them by our male standards because they don’t operate on the same frequency as us men (I’m not saying it’s fair, I’m just pointing out how things are).
I second that. If you guys wanna test it, do it with the picture of an average woman. You’ll see that you don’t even have to be that hot to get heaps of attention from men.
P.S. Not complaining or anything (have lots of sex from online) but Mike is spot on with his analysis.
Both men and women can be flakey had have bad behavior on dates. That does not make it right though. I was simply explaining the experiences I had when I was dating. You are making it a male vs female thing. I expressed that fact that men may have challenges in the dating world as well.
BD has stated many times, he does not recommend trying to fuck on the first date. So, I don’t think it’s a huge request to go on a first date to try to get to know someone. There’s always date number 2 for sex.
Maybe you should learn a different tactic. Try getting to know the person first instead of just looking for sex. I don’t know what dating sites you are on, but maybe try sites where people just want sex. You might have better luck there.
No thanks, dating as a woman was bad enough! I’m happy with who I found, I don’t need to make fake profiles.
I don’t comment on off-topic subjects (dating, specifically online dating, is off-topic for this post, so you guys can talk about that but I won’t), but I hope all of you realize that neither side will convince the other here. Seriously, an over-33 woman debating dating techniques with some manosphere/PUA guys isn’t going to result in anything productive (other than perhaps entertainment?). 🙂
Blackdragon,
I have a question for you about non-monogamy that I think you haven’t tackled yet on this blog. I’ve been reading religiously for the past 2-3 days and this is what I’ve been looking for my whole life. My father was non monogamist but I haven’t ever met him (he died when I was very young). I’ve always felt there is something to it.
Have you ever been in a situation where one of your MLTRs was seeing someone you both knew? A mutual friend, or someone from your social circle. How would you handle it? I think this is different to a FB, in that case, one would not care. However as you get romantic feelings for a MLTR, how do you manage 1. the feelz, 2. the social circle, say it happens that you and the dude meet each other or something.
As I just said in the comment above yours, I don’t comment on topics not on-topic to the article. If you wait until tomorrow, I’ll be posting a new article related to your question, and you’re more than welcome to ask it there. Other commenters here are also free to comment on your question here if they’d like.
@Aulixx I’ve wondered about those situations as well!
I play on a co-ed softball team where some of the players (including myself) have slept with more than one of the others.
One of the guys, R, slept with 3 girls on the team, but one quit and he was not hooking up with them around the same time. One of those girls, K, also hooked up with two other guys but again, not around the same time. This caused a some awkwardness and eventually they moved on but there is still some tension between certain people.
I wonder if they had been in MLTR relationships, would it have been possible to sleep with others on the team and still maintain friendships?
I’m seeing one of the guys on the team, N, and he and I had a threesome with one of the other girls, S, on the team. To my surprise, S and I ended up becoming closer friends.
However she was sleeping with R at the time and he got very upset about the threesome (even though he had been invited) and told her he didn’t want to have sex with her anymore, and wanted to stay just friends. I thought it was ridiculous he was upset about her sleeping with other people when he’d slept with 2 other girls on the team.
Since N and I are in an open relationship (my first real MLTR) I am curious to find out if there are any tips/strategies for dating people that are or could become part of your social circle…or if that should generally be avoided.
But I am just looking for sex. As are most men. If sending personalized messages, or “getting to know the person” was a faster and more effective tactic for getting a bang given the time constraints my lifestyle puts on me I’d be doing that instead. But I know it isn’t because I already tried that when I was a beta chump and I almost never got laid. Trust me I get laid way more now. As a man you have to put in the numbers.
@PinkFirefly
Hi, I saw your post and felt compelled to respond. Please note I love BlackDragon’s blog, I try model my life after it, and I have actually spoken to him on the phone for a paid consultation. So please note my response is NOT going to be filled with rage (I found the other poster’s response to you way over the top), and based partially on articles I have read, and things I have experienced. I hope that is ok and would love to hear your response – so let’s start with your own quotes, I’ll use direct quotes and paraphrase, and feel free to correct me anywhere.
“I think for many men, it’s hard for them to comprehend the world of online dating from a woman’s perspective. As far as a guy is concerned, women have it made. They have the choice of the litter. All they have to do is get online every day, sitting on their princess throne and file through the dozens or more profiles of men who have messaged them throughout the day. They then flippantly toss out all of those well thought out, carefully crafted messages from most of those poor schmucks, and then they log onto their Facebook accounts to complain to their girlfriends that there are no “good men” left in the world. Unfortunately, the reality is nowhere near that fantasy. I found that the majority of the emails I received were one liners or just said one word, “hot.” I have experienced many men on dates who had no manners, would show up late, and were rude to the waiter. Often I found that men would try to take me back to their place to fuck even before I pull out the chair to the bar for a drink (At least wait until the second date!)”
I think, specifically, where I disagree with this post, is that women, and I should clarify, women who take reasonable care of their looks, physique (eat well and go to the gym regularly, sleep on time, good attire, you know the drill – I try to do all of them), do have it made in one specific sense. They have the ability to be reactive in the dating process, to sift out the good from the bad, and go out on dates with guys who make the cut. You say most messages are bad. But the key word is ‘most’, not ‘all’ or ‘100%’. How were the ones that did not fall under ‘most’ or ‘all’? Did you read them? Were they well-written? Did the guys have photos that you liked? A profile you liked? Was their message well-tailored to yours? I’m genuinely curious if you mean those other messages that you never got to, or they were from guys who you didn’t find attractive (which is totally fine). Most women who I read complain about the majority of messages, but I don’t really hear anything about the minority. I would say that’s the trade off getting to be so reactive in the online dating process.
But if there is even 1% in your inbox of well-written messages from a guy whose photo and profile you liked, then that is 100% an opportunity to not only respond, but go on a date with that guy. Its extremely easy for that to happen, and probably would. Even if you did message some guys that didn’t write back, I would be willing to wage the response and in-meet up rate for guys who do respond would be around 50%. That is huge, and it means after some effort, you will be rewarded, pretty quickly.
Second, another place women have a huge advantage in online dating, is that you can message people first that you find attractive, and there is a much, much higher, statistical probability that they will respond, and that they will go on a date with you. Here are 2 articles that support this assertion:
http://jezebel.com/women-who-message-dudes-first-on-okcupid-are-getting-mo-1763848001
https://theblog.okcupid.com/a-womans-advantage-82d5074dde2d
You also later note you messaged BD first. And now you guys are seriously dating.
So I have pointed out at least two separate strong advantages that you have as a woman in getting a date that a man does not – the minority of messages you get may be from attractive, well spoken guys, and you can message guys on your own, and both scenarios carry a strong likelihood of not only a response, but an in-person meet up. But as you said, what if some of dates are still bad?
You mentioned that your dates were purely entertainment, and some guys pushed too hard for sex. I would respond that the above strategies may filter out those guys, and secondly, this is the part where I really disagree with women, is that some women say women want commitment/relationship/not to feel used, whereas alot of men want to meet up just for sex, which is where the differ on the purpose of the date. Whatever the reason you go out on a date, everything starts FROM a date, or an in person meet up. If you aren’t going on dates, you aren’t getting anywhere. A relationship, a hook up, a FWB relationship, and OLTR, or whatever, always starts with a date. I would argue getting and going on a date is the most important part of the process, and also the most overlooked. Women invariably have a much easier time with this specific aspect of dating. Any date is an opportunity for something to happen, and I think women go on dates so often, and they are so used to it, that they might not realize this is not how dating works for so many men. And I’m just speaking to online, I’m not even including the in-person advantages a woman has that a man doesn’t in getting a date. Nearly every positive interaction I have had with a woman in person, included kissing her sober, her buying me drinks, girls coming back to my place for a bottle of wine (in many instances I didn’t even initiate the initial conversation), always ends with them not responding when I send one follow up text to hang out (not a bunch like some creepy weirdo). Recently a girl’s whose number I got at a bar, approached just like you recommended, cracked some jokes, said she would love to go out for a slice of pizza with me, mentioned she was 21, and if that was a problem for me, to which I said no I’m 35 is that a problem, to which she said no, stopped responding mid-text exchange after the meet up when I said would Friday work to go out in response to a ‘a slice of pizza would be great!’ My guess is that they have so many avenues to meet guys, in person, social media, online dating, that they can’t keep track of all of them. I’m betting that is the case with you and I would bet you have passed out your number to a well-meaning guy but never responded when he hit you up, and may not even realize it. That’s the advantage of having options and being reactive in dating. If you go on more dates, you get alot more experience as well on how to date and how to act. Most men are fighting like crazy just to go on a handful of dates.
To address why some guys don’t approach in public, there was a time that I sent a bunch of shots to women at a restaurant because I saw it was one girls birthday. I had never done that in my life. I didn’t really get a good look at them because I was far away, I saw a sparker candle and a birthday cake, and sent it over to be friendly. 30 minutes later, I went up, just to say happy birthday, NOT hit on anyone, and say i sent the shots over. I was flipped off by one woman who said she would absolutely not tolerate this in front of her daughter, and told to fuck off. I smiled, said happy birthday, didn’t mean anything bad by it, politely excused myself, while the other 3 women grinned, and said nothing. Trying to be nice at a bar completely backfired. Sometimes rejections are harsh from an individual, or from a group. But that’s why some guys don’t approach in person – its not welcomed, and sometimes met with a very hostile response, regardless of how cordial and non-threatening you may be. It can be damaging to a guys ego.
And with respect to the argument that guys just push for sex – its not as if guys who advertise they want a relationship or they want to get to know a woman for her personality get dates in droves. They are flaked on, rejected, and cast aside just as easily as guys who push for sex or write a crude message online. And therein lies the frustration for many men in online dating, or dating in general.
That may also be why guys push so hard for sex without waiting – what’s the point if a girl is going to ghost on you and not give you an opportunity to properly court her? That really is the reality of most of us guys who aren’t Ryan Gosling. I think some dating coaches would agree, its actually easier to get one-night stands than it is dates, because many women, especially under 30, will agree to a date, but simply vanish after that, or cancel last minute. Or you have to employ lots of brainpower and tactics to ensure the date actually happens, after the date is actually scheduled. I don’t like the idea of pushing for sex quick, but I’m starting to consider it. Believe me, flaking and ghosting has ate courtship alive. Even BD said a good 40% of his first dates online cancelled in a prior article. That’s with doing EVERYTHING right.
Now, put yourself in a man’s shoes. You may be average looking, but you everything you are supposed to do (work out, eat well, take care of yourself), you have a good job, and you’re not a creep. You send out 100s of messages. The vast majority well-tailored to a woman’s profile. And not to super models – girls that you find attractive, but may be within your ‘league’. It is an incredible time investment. And you get zero replies. Sometimes you get a one-word response, and no follow up. Sometimes the girl takes down her profile. Sometimes she disappears mid-exchange. Sometimes you get lots of exchanges, that may eventually lead the phone number, and a date. This is 1% of the time, contrasted to your 50% of the time. A good chunk of the time, you never actually get to the meet up because the girl cancels. Look at BD’s numbers. The amount of work he puts in to get his dates is staggering. So far, in my 7 years of using OKcupid, I have went on exactly one date with a girl I found to be cute, and I had play it super cool and employ BD strategy and another dating coach whose book I bought. She cancelled our first date, moved our second date from dinner to coffee, and cut it short after an hour. Another girl messaged me back and forth, then we went to texting, and she ghosted and took down her profile right before our first date – catfish (that I never sent money to).
I don’t feel like most women who are reasonably attractive have to consider or even think about this dynamic when they go on dates. I’m curious, when you did go out on dates, did you wonder if the guy will actually show up, or ghost on you? Or is it something you never gave a single thought to?
You state the following :
“Some of the messages were from men who sent my best friend the same exact messages, often minutes apart”
That’s because women in online do not respond at a significantly higher percentage to personalized messages versus cut and paste. As I stated above, it is an incredible time investment to craft 10 well-written, personalized messages. If women online respond and replied to every single well-crafted message (and it doesn’t sound like you get many, even though I’m sure you are an attractive, bright women as you dating BD).
So I guess in conclusion, your experiences sound like alot of shitty ones, with a few good ones, and you have total control to make those happen, and keep going. Mine are 99% shitty, and 1% good ones that have potential, that usually go nowhere. I’m not saying you have it easy, but you definitely have it easier.
Here is the final article I think you would love to read, it was a dating coach going online as a guy, and seeing how different the experience was:
http://www.artofflirting.com/do-women-have-an-advantage-in-dating-part-5-lizs-experience-online-dating-as-a-guy
What I have learned from my experiences, is that as a man you have to make life work for you, in every situation, as a man, to enjoy life, whether girls are in the picture or not. If I don’t have plans on a Friday night, I may watch netflix, hit the gym and sauna, or study. If I’m at a bar alone, I flip out a study guide for my work on my cellphone while having a drink. If you schedule a date with a woman, you pick something you were going to do anyway, so if she doesn’t show up, you’re not upset, because its something you would have enjoyed to do by yourself anyway. That’s how you get by as a man, being 100% independent of any situation, whether or not you get dates. I don’t know that this is true of women, they get dates just by looking good and showing up in my opinion.
Thanks for reading.
What about Mad Men? Isnt that Holywood? Those guys are quite far from monogamous, and also in there it looks like dating and hooking up is easy but marriages are not. So I guess there are exceptions.
Do you really try to model the way you live after BD? Cuz BD would never complain like this. This is the attitude of someone who is very much outcome dependent. Like seriously, this is some major weaksauce. I don’t put in nearly as much time and guess what I’m good. When hunting hardcore, I can rack up a good 4-6 first dates, roughly half of them leading to sex, in a month. And this was before I moved to a big city. And I’m meh looking. And I don’t make a ton of money.
Read BD’s online dating book again; he doesn’t put in much effort at all, maybe an hour and some change a day. Online dating isn’t as awesome as it was 10 or even 5 years ago, but its still WAY better than live cold approaching where you could get arrested if you get at a chick the wrong way (but then again cold approaching has ALWAYS been illegal, only it was homeless people who were the only ones who cold approached back in the day).
Also I’m sympathetic to what firefly is saying. If I had a whole bunch of chicks hit me up all the time either begging for attention or sex I’d be pretty overwhelmed actually. I’d have to waste time getting rid of the chicks who just want me to take care of their kids, the degenerate party girls, and then I’d possibly find a decent chick.
Its a different struggle. Placing your struggle above anyone else’s is very weak. Look, I was caught in a whirlwind tempest of trauma, broken homes and loss for the first 30 years of my life. By 30, I had self-harmed more than I had sex. But I wouldn’t change a damn thing about it. But my whirlwind tempest is not better than anyone else’s, it just is. If you really are a big BD follower and are part of the SMIC then this should be automatic thinking, no?
Chicks are the sexual receivers for the most part and dudes are the sexual projectors for the most part. Do you want that to change? Do you want to be the one who has to wait for the right chick to hit you up? I don’t know about you but I’d rather be the one who has to get out there and get it.
Its like my bowling buddies say: “Let’s goooo git it!!” I don’t want that to change ever. I’m enjoy being the one to have to hit up tons of chicks so that 1 in every 30 or so meets with me. It means I EARNED it. Hell that’s even on my OKC profile under things I value that I want the chick to value: Earning things the right way.
Never disrespect the grind.
@joelsuf
Appreciate your input, but my reply was addressed to Pinkfirefly, not you. I wrote it specifically for her.
Nice dodge mate. PF’s ASD aside, joelsuf’s right. If you’re getting zero responses from 100’s of openers or a 1% hit rate on your conversations then you’re doing something wrong.
This is truly getting off topic, so this will be the last comment I’ll make.
Waiting for the second date to fuck makes me have ASD huh? Call it what you want, but I don’t see anything wrong with waiting for the second date. BD doesn’t even recommend trying to fuck on the first date. You guys are making this very entertaining, thanks for the laugh 🙂
@Pinkfirefly,
Please please read my post – I have not used any such terms and I was totally respectful in it. Some other guys jumped in, but it was written for you. I wont debate you, I am genuinely interested to know your thoughts. The other posters like Jack N the Box and the one who used the term ASD do not speak for me at all. They do not reflect my values in anyway.
She’s over 35, of course she’s gonna have ASD. Hell any chick who respects herself on some level should have some form of ASD no matter how old they are, instead of being a degenerate and having like 5 kids by 25 and then hoping that the government will take care of them. You should be happy when it takes 2-4 dates to have sex with a chick. It means that they are not on the carousel and it means that you can usually hit it raw without getting an STD. If you aren’t needy af and are getting at more than 2 chicks at once you won’t care. Perspective and outcome independence, boys. It sucks that even BD’s fans don’t have a shred of it.
I wasn’t even calling him out about that. If I hit up nothing but super attractive chicks, of course the e-approach to response ratio is gonna be mad low. But I’m not gonna be butthurt about it, I’ll either 1) get at chicks who are less attractive, or 2) just enjoy the grind and keep moving.
Many men who say that they are “alpha” don’t know how to do this, especially item #2.
Being needy, which is relying on a chick for the majority of your good emotions isn’t alpha in any sense of the word.
and
Johnny doe, if you were being serious while writing those words, you have much bigger woman problems than anything you might discuss in this thread, and you seriously need to fix them or turn in your man card. I haven’t seen this level of beta in months, and I browse a lot.
Major slut shaming and traditional conservatism detected. Initiating red pill countermeasures now:
Oh Joelsuf! What are we going to do with you?
WHAT???? So now you’re a tradcon? Dude, what the fuck happened to you? You sound like one of those conservative fathers who tried to make me believe that I was “disrespecting” his daughter by wanting to fuck her when I was 14. So you’re a Puritan now who thinks sex is “disrespectful” to women and celibacy means “respecting herself?” Huh?
Rest in peace man!
False bipolar dilemma! How about a third option? Instead of thinking in ones and zeros, how about ones and infinity? That’s the difference between us and computers, or us and autistic people (or just the bipolar).
What does being irresponsible and reckless have to do with ASD? We’re talking about sexual liberation here, not being stupid or neglectful with birth control.
Roosh? Is that you? What have you done with Joelsuf? I demand his safe return!
But I WANT them on the carousel. Any woman who isn’t on the carousel is not worth my time. I thought we were all sex-positive men here!
I hit my girlfriend raw without getting an STD despite her being on the carousel. Because she’s very responsible about it and I trust her. Seriously, you’re making the typical tradcon mistake of linking irresponsible behavior with sexual promiscuity.
Seriously, so you’re a Roosh fan now? When did you become a tradcon? I thought we agreed that tradcons are worse than feminists because they teach their daughters that sex is “disrespectful” at best and the rape of their pure virgin angels at worst, thus traumatizing teenage boys by making them think they’re horrible human beings for wanting to have sex with teenage girls! I thought you and I agreed that Puritanism is bad?
If a woman isn’t on the carousel or won’t fuck me quickly, she isn’t worth my time. I guess I’ll leave the prudes to you and your fellow tradcons!
Damn man! This is so disappointing. You’ve become the conservative father telling his daughter to “cover up,” lecturing her that sex “damages her,” and threatening her boyfriend with a gunshot wound to the head if he fucks your daughter, as if it’s no different than rape! You’ve become the same type of man who shamed me for having sexual urges at 13. Shame on you! Shame on all slut shamers!
Nothing. That’s what. Even BD himself has called you out for being pissy. And here you are, being pissy. Like usual. Shouting insults at other posters…like usual.
How about I was making an exaggeration to prove a point? And guess what, here you come out of the woodworks, so it worked. And quite well might I add. Like it always does with those like you.
If me observing that chicks are sexually irresponsible (I have no problem with the responsible ones) makes me a tradcon, then I have no problem being one. But I’m pretty sure most tradcons would even have problems with the responsible ones. So no, I’m not. Try again.
Different than the closeted homo MGTOW who project their insecurities onto others, my definition of the carousel is much different. I support chicks who enjoy sex when they are responsible about it. But when I see high school chicks having sex so they can have kids so that the government can take care of them and they call that being an “independent woman” (don’t tell me you haven’t noticed this trend), I’m gonna call them out on it. That’s what I mean by the carousel.
I’m not attacking her or any chick who does that. I did the same with my last gf. That isn’t what I’m talking about here. I’m talking about chicks who run around and party and have sex with dudes at these parties, regret it, and then call rape. Those are the chicks I’m attacking.
And you assumed that I was making that connection.
Oh yeah, ever since I got banned from his board for making fun of and calling out Matt Forney, I’ve been a huge fan, lemme tell ya.
Um, we agreed to that? Some of it is good, some of it is bad. Most of it just needs to be adjusted a bit. Like most things. I don’t think in black and white. The whole “wait until marriage to have sex” is antiquated, sure. But is it really bad? Not really. Its intentions are good. So maybe it needs to be scaled down a bit. Maybe something like “have sex whenever you want, just make sure you educate yourself first.” No, I’m not counting on any organized religion to push such a narrative. But that doesn’t automatically make them bad. I’m not some violent atheist or ANTIFA who wants to push their own narrative. Puritanism is antiquated, not bad. There is a difference.
No. They are the same. Both reactionary collectivist, both want supremacy. Maybe not now, but definitely in the future. And by the way, I find it funny that I can bring up this observation in a Critical Theory English class in college after watching a Sarkeesian video and have the professor herself slightly agree with me, but yet when I say similar things online people get butthurt. But that’s just a random observation of mine that isn’t pertinent to this discussion. Or is it? Hmm…..
Yeah, because a chick who waits 2-4 dates to have sex is a total prude. The exact same as arranged marriages and being chaperoned on dates. Yup. Same thing.
Why you decide to place any kind of emotional investment into any online discussion is beyond me.
I’ll take “responding in blind rage and wild accusations” for $1000, Alex.
Seriously. Its like the outcome dependence/neediness is palpable. It’s both funny and unsettling at the same time.
No Caleb. I won’t “lose my shit” if you ban me. I have repeatedly stated that I fully acknowledge your right to ban anyone you want from your private blog, just like I imagine you’ll acknowledge my right to do the same when I get a blog of my own (which I will).
Plus I’ve been “on the verge of getting banned” from Sedfast for years and years, as well as from most other Internet forums that I have been a part of that deal in controversial topics. But no one has ever actually banned me because I do follow the rules, even if reluctantly.
But if you do ban me from here, I’m hoping we can at least maintain friendly relations elsewhere, and that I may seek your advice in the future on whatever topic I need it, either via email or a business transaction in the form of me purchasing some of your future ebooks or materials. Your products are definitely worth the money and I recommend them to all men struggling in their lives.
It’s okay. I can indulge in my passionate responses without personal attacks or ad hominems.
And they must comply with you sexually. I, however, take it one step further. She must not only comply with me sexually, but have a personality, character, attitude, and mindset which is not repugnant to my own, thus allowing her sexual compliance to be enthusiastic, as well as a natural extension of her like-minded approach to the topic of sexuality.
Obviously, I wouldn’t tolerate Pink Firefly in my bed, even if she sexually complied with me. Her prudish attitude and mindset about the world, as well as about sexuality, is so repulsive to me, that getting turned on would be a nearly impossible chore on my part. As I stated before, I do have physical standards, but my primary turn on is the woman’s personality and sexual attitude. That’s why I need a high sex drive, open minded free spirit, not a traditionalist like your girl.
It’s that sex-positive part that makes all alpha 1.0s hate me with a passion. They love being sexually territorial and calling me (and guys like you) a beta cuckold. They try to control the woman’s actions when she’s not with them, keep tabs on her, and try to get her to worship them. By contrast, I let my women do whatever they want when they are not with me, and I prefer they fuck other men (since breaking their free spirits would turn me off) and tell me about it so I can be happy for them and sometimes even be a part of their sex life with others in the form of threesomes, group sex, etc…
The concept of female purity disgusts me, which is why alpha 1.0s usually disgust me.
So a woman was desperately horny for you. But instead of acting on her own desires, she declared war against herself (a hallmark of low self esteem) in the name of bullshit societal conventions, and that didn’t make you at least lose respect for her? Personally, I can tolerate and respect any rejection with stoicism, as long as the rejection is a reflection of the woman’s true personality and desires. But when I see that she is just a mindless follower forcing herself to suck society’s dick even against her own will, I can’t help but hold in contempt this form of self-rape. Individual weakness has always bothered me. It’s not good for my own energy. I’ve always sought out a higher class of people who do what they want and refuse to do what they don’t want.
Because I’m not, and never have been, inclined towards Marxism, I’ve never looked at this from an economic class point of view, but I’ve noticed that the poorer a person is, the less they, on average, tend to own themselves. There are exceptions in the sense that some poor people are diehard individualists, but the most sexually inhibited and/or culturally/politically programmed blue pillers tend to be the poorest, and the higher the economic class the more red pill and individualistic/self-owning the people tend to be.
I’ve never sought out rich people for friendship or rich women for sex (beyond assuring myself that a rich woman won’t be a gold digger), but the people whom I gravitate towards and who emotionally lift me up instead of bringing me down with their bullshit tend to be rich or upper middle class, with very few poor examples.
But yeah, a gloomy or self-hating vibe tends to spoil my fun, and that all begins with a lack of self-ownership and a sheep/follower mentality, which is why I avoid women who refuse to sleep with me but than masturbate while thinking of me. The self-rape, or self-war, just makes me sick, no different than watching someone who’s suicidal or a drug addict. I don’t want that kind of negativity in my life.
I won’t say that I never get mad in real life. But I minimize my anger by simply cutting off from my life the types of people who would fill me with rage (like Pink Firefly), which is why my girlfriend, my fuck buddies, and others would tell you that I’m very happy. Whereas you would only next someone who gives you drama, I’ll next them if their personalities don’t click with mine, which is often.
So since I’ve created for myself a nice bubble of like minded women, there’s really not much for me to get mad about in real life. But on the Internet, it’s just fun to explain to certain blue pill people why I find them contemptible, whereas in real life, I’d probably just excommunicate them (unless they pressed me for a debate).
It’s the “not getting angry” part that’s hard because it’s difficult for me not to call out stupidity, especially if that stupidity manifests itself in behaviors which the person committing them disagrees with, but feels like they must perform in order to conform to their culture or societal standards. Hypocrisy pisses me off. I cannot have sex with such women or interact with such people in real life. Their weakness stinks worse than yesterday’s garbage.
You’re talking about logic and I’m talking about emotions.
Incorrect. They stopped banning people from there at least three years ago. Silvertree is a lot nicer and more tolerant than I am.
Of course. I don’t get angry (that would be you) nor am I angry at anyone I’ve banned before (what few people I’ve actually banned from here; me actually banning someone at this blog is a pretty rare event).
I place those odds at less than 50%.
No they do not. They can do whatever they want when I’m fucking them. Of course I have my preferences like all human beings do, but I don’t enforce them. I’m Alpha 2.0.
And to me, none of that crap is relevant for a FB, or in some cases even a low-end MLTR. At the high-end MLTR and above levels, then I start to care, but even then it’s not a big deal. (Notice how even though PF and I agree on the big picture, she clearly disagrees with me on a few things; I just don’t care. I have a very full life and have bigger things to concern myself with.)
Pink Firefly is in an open relationship with a man who regularly has sex other women and is 100% opposed to traditional marriage, and moreover, publicly discusses it on a blog that is read by literally millions of people, including her own family. Calling her a “traditionalist” demonstrates how irrational and nonsensical you’re being.
This is what happens when you don’t control your emotions, Jack. It turns you into an idiot.
Wow! I’ve never seen you violate your own rules before. Did I break you? HA HA!
Please report yourself to yourself, and give yourself a warning. Maybe get PF to spank you as well. LOL!
Read my comment again, slowly. I didn’t violate any of my own rules. For an ex-lawyer you don’t seem to read well. And for someone who prides himself on always walking right up to the rules without breaking them, this is now, I believe, the fourth time you’ve whined when someone does it to you.
(I’ve just lowered those odds to 30%.)
@blackdragon
This is total BS. Whether you agree or disagree with my comments, i wrote a non disrespectful rebuttal to PinkFirefly’s post, and it got hijacked by JackNtheBox, Joelsuf, azog, and Gilsalad. I didn’t say I need to slap her around or she had ASD. I just wanted a two-reply exchange and these over eager users jumped in with their own opinions and are NOT the people I addressed my reply to, and Pinkfirefly is now off this thread.
Welcome to the internet.
I know this might be a shock, but on the internet, anyone can say or not say whatever they want. At this blog, commenters can say whatever they want to me or other commenters as long as they follow these five rules. If this freedom upsets you, I suggest you don’t post here (or on any other blog for that matter).
It doesn’t upset me, it annoys me that they offended PinkFirefly to the point where she got off the thread before responding to my reply to her post. I think some of the things Jack N the Box and other posters said to Pink Firefly bordered on name calling. But whatever.
Johnny, it’s clear from your comments on past threads that you suffer from some very severe issues and keep complaining about the same things over and over again. Please seek counseling / therapy immediately, and do so from a qualified professional and not from the women on this blog, which you keep attempting to do. This is not the first time you’ve thrown around your negative, whiny, needy bullshit on my blog and I’m getting a little tired of it. Thanks in advance.
It’s getting kind of old to point out every time someone misrepresents Jack’s relationship with the box, but Gilsalad is a nice innovation. Gil means light, correct? Gil Salad™, no mayonnaise, low on calories!
@Anon: LOL, I was gonna comment on the innovative use of my nickname (if I had a dollar for every time…) but thought it wasn’t worth it. At Tolkien Gateway they say Gil means star and Galad means bright. Anyway, it’s funny I got mentioned together with “Azog”, looks like there’s no shortage of Tolkien fans on this blog :p
At least he got my name right!
@blackdragon
I didn’t see how I broke one of your five posting rules.
I disagreed with a stated position by PinkFirefly and clearly stated why, and specifically said I won’t go back and forth on it, because I hear a lot of girls say it’s not like how I describe it.
I just wanted to know how I am off and consider a different perspective, not seek counseling. I don’t know what other threads you are referring to, but in those, again, I don’t see how I’m breaking one of the five rules that you mentioned.
Other posters above disagreed with her position and said so.
But I will no longer post on this particular topic going forward, I really like your blog and enjoy reading it.
Joelsuf I read you comment and I agree. It is much harder for men to approach both online and in person, especially if your average looking. Women have too many options today, so they can’t really focus on any one. In my opinion, talking about it does not necessarily mean you are whining about it; just recognizing a harsh reality. In my experience a lot of macho guys tend to pooh pooh those guys who talk about experiences that bother them, maybe in an attempt to show how tough they are to be unfazed by disappointing, and sometimes downright unpleasant, experiences. Of course it is a bit off-putting when you have to expend so much energy trying to connect with women, who generally don’t have to worry about hooking up with men at all. Speaking for myself sometimes I find myself wishing I had the money to just hire escorts to short circuit all the bullshit. This is just to get sex. As for relationships, I am slowly losing faith in those, because based on my direct experience, observations and research I am beginning to believe that women at a basic level only respond to a judicious mix of very good sex and indifference, and not to love at all. I am beginning to wonder if they find men who are “in love” with them boring. Anyway, all that is to say: Is the juice worth the squeeze?
Sorry Johnny Doe, I was supporting your initial post, not Joelsuf’s whose name I worte by mistake.
I never said you broke the rules. I said you’re irritating me. You’re still allowed to post here, since unlike other bloggers, irritating me is allowed. (I’m for free speech, even if it disagrees with me.) Just get some fucking therapy. Seriously.
@blackdragon
That is not my intention at all.
As I said I will not be posting on this topic going forward. I would have liked PinkFirefly’s take on my post, but no worries at all.
Thanks for running an awesome blog.
Hollywood goes to great lengths to discredit alternatives to Disney:
Friends with kids – this film is great… until the ending.
It’s like one of those films that was all a dream – extremely annoying.
I guess it’s the same feeling everyone gets when Disney is revealed to be false.
@ Jack
Can you link it here once you get in going? I think it would definitely be interesting.
Not sure I completely agree with Jack on this re PF, but have always been curious how long a girl with this much Disney would last as a FB. You mentioned in one of your latest articles that you made her OLTR after a year and half, after begining as a FB, but have never mentioned how long she lasted as FB before making her MLTR. My guess would be a couple months at most, but I’m guessing you had strong EFA/game, so I could be wrong.
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A historical note, BD,
Your description is perfect, and what you’re describing is also the plot of every romance novel in existence too. Chick Flicks are filmed versions of romance novels played out by actors.
Women’s appetite for these things is insatiable. In America alone over 7,000 new romance novels are published every year. That’s more than every other category of book (fiction, non-fiction, textbooks) combined!
These things have been produced ever since the invention of writing. There are romance novels written in the time of the Roman Empire that have survived. In fact, Daphnis & Chloe can be downloaded on gutenberg.org
This is powerful stuff. Like catnip for females. I’m starting to understand why both Mark Cunningham and David Shade have said that if you want to understand what’s going on inside your typical female- understand romance novels. I’m actually in the process of looking into this.